GIP

[butterfly]

Because, hey, everyone needs somebody to love them.

Also, I'm still not seeing the blondeness. Her hair is certainly lighter than someone else's, but that doesn't mean that it's blonde. I'd say light brown. But that's what I call my own hair color, which my mom has argued is blonde.

Shockingly enough (not), I can't sleep. Usually can't after crying.

Not sure what to work on.

Like I said earlier, everything I do now feels like it's going to be the wrong thing. It can take a while for that to work out of my system.

Though it will. It took a fucking long time for me to build up my feelings of self-worth and I'm not going to let someone else's view of me knock them back down.

When bad things happen, I close off, back away, and do the polite thing while burying my feelings. This is probably unhealthy. Hence the over-share today.

I don't get mad at people. Never found it too productive. And I generally only take off the overly-polite mask when I know people well - like Benton Fraser does, to use a fictional example.

I only argue with family. They're the only ones that I trust not to leave if I get mad once in a while.

To go back to talking about the rpg, in a very real way, Alexis and Aly are both me in different outfits. What I do with them... everything that I have written in the rpg has come from my heart and my muse. And I don't regret thinking it or writing it. I regret posting it in the wrong forum, but I still don't think that the subject matter is out of line in fiction. I don't think that any subject is out of line in fiction as long as you treat it respectfully.

But I do understand that not all people feel that way.

Comments

[bcassie.livejournal.com]

I agree any subject should be able to be dealt with in fiction, but I also think that the Soup was the wrong forum for such a massively emotional subject as AIDS. Mostly because HIV has such enormous social and emotional repucussions, the ripple effect of which is far reaching. It effects everyone around the person and as such would impact on nearly every thread.

I also found it upsetting because for me, it tainted all the Lex/Dave interactions and took away the fun in their relationship.

On a more serious personal note, I found it brought back unhappy memories as my favourite uncle died from AIDS and it was a long and painful end to his young life.

I hope you don't take some of the comments to heart, most people like myself were just so shocked and upset and were not making a personal attack on you the writer. I didn't even know you were the writer until it was mentioned by TBQ, for me it was a matter of the subject being overwhelming on an interpersonal scale.

It's a perfectly legitimate subject matter, but I feel it would be better served in a more intimate genre. I also think based on your obvious skill that it would be a brilliant and emotion piece.

Please don't get yourself upset and doubting yourself. You're a wonderful writer. Your Lex is a rich and 'real' character and his background is heartbreaking and colourful. I'm especially intrigued by his relationship dynamics with Michael and how he overlooked the obvious abuse of power and love.

I know all about self-harm and anger turned inward from a personal stance as I do it myself, if ever you want to talk I'd be more than happy. bcassieangel@aol.com or bcassieangel on IM.

Hugs and take care.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

*hugs back*

Very sorry about your uncle. It's always horrible when people die. Which is way obvious, but... sometimes that's all you can say - the obvious sadness.

Thanks for the compliment on my writing. That's always nice to hear.

The thing that bugs me is that... I can see that it bothers people now but no one said it was over the line when it started. I posted and Seth's player answered, which felt like confirmation that it wasn't over the line, because if it were, I would have expected either an email explaining that or deletion of the comment, followed by an email. And Seth's player had my email address (though it actually wasn't up on the info page, which I have now fixed).

I mean, I can't read minds. And I have four hundred and fifty-eight journals friended. I didn't see anything about all that in my quick skims before and after work.

[bcassie.livejournal.com]

The thing that bugs me is that... I can see that it bothers people now but no one said it was over the line when it started. I posted and Seth's player answered, which felt like confirmation that it wasn't over the line, because if it were, I would have expected either an email explaining that or deletion of the comment, followed by an email. And Seth's player had my email address (though it actually wasn't up on the info page, which I have now fixed).

That's perfectly understandable, I didn't start reading the thread until near the end and I as I said I didn't kow you were the writer. After TBQ mentioned it, I went to your user page, but there was just a text service and I don't understand how those work and the time zone difference and such. I would have emailed you, but too late now - that's why I've responded here.

It is a very sensitive subject for a lot of people probably more so than anything else and I think that's why people commented. I hope you don't let you put this put you off from addressing important emotional subjects, but Soup-wise I think death's too real and impacts on everything else as it does in real life.

You are a wonderful writer - can't emphasize that enough, I'm sorry you got hurt.

*Smooches*

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Thanks. I just... there were 10 responses before I was told that she wasn't comfortable with it. I hate that I put her through that pain and didn't know. Hate that it could have been avoided.

[theferretgirl.livejournal.com]

When I first read the threat I thought Aly meant she was pregnant. (it was pointed out to me and the way that was done made me feel rather stupid) Now that I read the whole thing I can see she's not. Somehow it doesn't bother me as it (or so it seems) does most people. Probably because I don't know anyone who had or has this disease.

You are a wonderful writer. And yes I agree that the other writer should have contacted you when she had the feeling this was going over her head. Personally I'm going to stay out of this, since I feel I have no right to get involved.

I could say 'don't let this get to you'. But that'd be stupid right? Because it obviously already has. Just know that you're a very good writer. I adore your Alexis and your Aly you are a valued player of the Soup.

I hope I've worded this right. Usually when I open my mouth I end up sticking my foot in it. :-)

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

No, you're being very sweet. Thank you.

And yeah, I can see where you're coming from. Before the whole thing solidified, that actually was one of the possibilities of the 'huge thing' that Aly wanted to tell Seth.

[stakebait.livejournal.com]

I agree, no subject is out of line in fiction as long as you treat it respectfully. I think the question is,

a) is putting it into a parody context treating it respectfully

and the converse,

b) do other players find that the need to treat it respectfully hampers their ability or desire to do parody

It would screw me up if I were playing -- and so would giving any character any (so far) invariably fatal disease, because from then on I'd feel like I was throwing cream pies at a funeral. But I'm not playing, nor even consistantly reading, so I don't get a vote.

The former makes me, to say the least, twitchy. I wouldn't do it, and I wouldn't read it. But I don't know that I would feel the need to comment on it if the subject hadn't been raised. You obviously draw your own lines, as do we all.

Personally I also find this is an area where it squicks me more in RPF than in FPF. I guess I feel like most reasonable public figures could cope with running across the idea that people are imagining them having sex for fun. That people are imagining them dying for fun, not so much.

It seems to me that if those concerned had contacted you privately, things might have worked out better.

Still like you. *hugs*

Mer

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

*hugs*

Thanks. And I get the concerns, but I didn't at the time, because to me, fiction is fiction is fiction. It can be deep or respectful or incredibly scary or none of the above, but it isn't real.

I should have emailed the concerned party before I brought it into the game, but I didn't really know where I was going before I actually posted. And when it was responded to, I just assumed that meant it was okay. Again, yes, assuming is a bad thing, but I've decided to chalk it up to a learning experience. Hopefully this will keep me from making that mistake again.

*hugs*

[coneyislandbaby]

And what you said. Seriously. Fiction is fiction is fiction, full stop. There may be things I'm uncomfortable about reading, but I would never, ever say that it was inappropriate or wrong to write them or to post them.

On reading the comments, I think you took a very brave step in writing, one I'm not sure I could take at this point, in any kind of writing. I have very personal issues with writing fatal (or potentially fatal) diseases outside of canon occurrences, but there are times it is right for the characters. I've read some wonderful stories with, say, Scully's cancer on X-Files (even more personally difficult for me, as is any cancer story).

Just don't let what anyone says stop you from being you and writing what you write.

And I'd actually like to read this - could you point me to it? I gather it's in the Angel RPS RPG?

And more *hugs* just because.

Re: *hugs*

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

*hugs back*

Thank you. And it's in one of the side journals - glosseth. It's here (http://www.livejournal.com/users/glosseth/13636.html).

But yeah, for some people (and I'm not saying this is the case for the person in question), fiction is emotion is reality. Which is valid, but means that we're working on two totally different wave lengths.

Re: *hugs*

[coneyislandbaby]

*hugs again*

Thank you.

You're welcome, seriously.

And it's in one of the side journals - glosseth. It's here.

Thanks. I will read it, but late at night is not good for me to read stuff like that, I've found - I'll definitely go there tomorrow and look at it, though.

But yeah, for some people (and I'm not saying this is the case for the person in question), fiction is emotion is reality. Which is valid, but means that we're working on two totally different wave lengths.

I understand that, but yeah, it's a wavelength I don't ever completely understand. I certainly do engage emotionally with texts, of all kinds (there's a song on the David Bowie CD I'm currently listening to that's brought me to tears twice tonight, for example) but I still know it's fiction, even though it engages me that much. I think it's different for everyone, though.

Re: *hugs*

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I still know it's fiction, even though it engages me that much.
Right, I mean, Moulin Rouge can make me cry 'til the sun goes down - doesn't make it any less fiction. But for some people, the distinction isn't so very clear and I can respect that. Not entirely certain that I understand it, but I respect it.

[zyre.livejournal.com]

I realize that I'm probably the worst of the worst right now, and I appologize. I never intended for my post to turn into anything more than a little "This is bothering me, and I'm not entirely sure why" thing.

And, well, Cassie and Mer kind of called it, in their comments, so I'll leave it at that. But, again, I never wanted to start anything like that. Because I don't do that, I don't like bringing people down.

I get the muse thing. Danny is me with a penis, yo. LOL And, every character I write is a piece of me, I do understand that. Believe me. And I would never try and poopoo that, because again, not a fan of bringing folks down. Aly is a wonderful character, I don't have any problem with that. I don't want you to think that I don't like her or Alexis, because I do.

And you know, I agree. If handled correctly, I think that AIDS could be a very, very good idea in fiction. It just seemed like the repurcussions of doing something like that in a game where it was basically a sexual free for all were really scary to me. I don't want to come home from my angsty stupid life and go to my happy game and suddenly deal with my lovely little boy being sick. Which is stupid, because he wouldn't be, but you know. I paniced, lol.

I agree with everyone, in that you are an amazing writer. And, I love, love, love playing with you and Alexis, and I'm sure I would love playing with Aly too. This didn't have anything to do with my opinions on who you are, or who they are. (That said, I've been told that Danny is about to fall completely, madly in love, and his very first thought was "I should tell Alexis!" hee.) It was just me taking a step back and saying "Hey. Wait a sec."

Anyway, *hug* and I'm sorry, again, that things went a weird direction.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

*hugs back*

It wasn't anything specific. Just would have liked to know before it became a Huge Thing. Easy as that *snaps fingers* and it's just a sad might-have-been fanfic in the 'soup verse. But I would have liked to know before people got hurt. I don't like hurting people, 'specially when I didn't have to (And eee! that's so sweet. Alexis would totally be way supportive).

[luvs-phoenix.livejournal.com]

Hey luv. So glad to hear from you. All day yesterday I waited with baited breath to see if you would hear about this beforehand or get hit with it after you came online.

I, myself, didn't know about it till later last night as I was out doing blissfully RL things like shopping, LOL.

I can see all sides of the issue, honestly. Sounds like it was more a large amount of miscommunication more than anything.

Myself? I'm uncomfortable with the subject of AIDS in parody. I'm bi and most of my friends are gay. I deal with AIDS (not me, again, but people I know). Not a subject I'm comfortable with. But, then, my mum died of cancer a year ago almost to the day so wouldn't wanna read a cancer thread either, LOL.

Problem for me, on a personal level, is that as Miss A I don't pick and choose what I want to read. I read it all. Major, minor, all LJs (though sometimes I forget to go back, oh 10 pages to see if someone FINALLY tagged, LOL). It's my "job" at the Soup and I love it. Period.

What do I expect from the Soup? Until now I hadn't even thought of it, LOL. I have absolutely NO trouble with angst. As a huge lover (ex really) of daytime TV I adore the big love 'em, break 'em up, put 'em back together threads. I also don't usually have a problem with characters handling RL issues such as cutting themselves (Nick) or abuse (er, Nick again? LOL). As a BK I love anything that's Dom/Sub so Tony/Robin or James? Does it for me.

I understand that not everyone feels that way. Go them! Heh.

I would have reported, had everyone agreed on the thread, the AIDS storyline as Miss A because, again, its my job...but I feel uncomfortable with it on such a personal level that I would prefer it just dropped.

However, I am not you. Or Gloss, or TBQ or hey, anyone but me. Just my opinion. If you choose to start the thread up in another place, and all parties agree, I will certainly record it in my log. I expect the quality of the writers at the Soup to respect the issue and deal with it in a way that won't make ME walk away from it all.

Funny enough, I had no ideal you were heading the way you did when "we" talked the other night, LOL. I though Aly was pregnant (like TFG). I thought "that will put a kink in the David/Alexis relationship" heh. I was just thrown, like everyone else with the AIDS thing.

I am truly hoping this will just be let go and everyone will find their level of comfort again at the Soup.

Like Zort said. It's SUPPOSE to be fun for godsake, LOL.

I think this was a 3-4 don't you?

To answer my own question... what do I expect from the Soup? To be entertained. To be drawn into another world where my bills, kids and my own relationships are NOT on my mind every fucking minute. To have fun. To meet wonderful characters and writers. To watch Angel and laugh my ass off because I just KNOW David's fucking Alexis.

::hugs sweetie::

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

More like a 3-12 than a 3-4, I think. Craziness all around. And, you know, there's no way that all of that stuff that was happening with me could have been known, so I guess I can see why people would assume that I was writing that because... well, no, I can't, because I don't see where I've ever been flippant about these things... but... 3-4.

Major communications break-down on both sides, though it did start with me.

[luvs-phoenix.livejournal.com]

No sweetie, you haven't been. No one thought you were just throwing the AIDS thread to be flipant. Not at all. I, certainly, understood you to be totally serious and wanting to deal with this particular subject in a serious way.

It has a lot more to do WITH the subject than the way it was broched. A lot of us have had to actually deal with AIDS and there's no way in hell you could have known it.

Like I said it would be even worse for me if someone wrote a cancer thread as my mum passed from it almost a year to the day.

I think it was just a lot of miscommunication and it's been cleared. No family (heh, you should see mine) runs smoothly. Doesn't happen.

Now, I want you to take Alexis over to the Robin thread and give him a very heavy dose of in your face "coldness" that I know Lex can do so well. No, Lex does NOT come out fighting like Robin does but he DOES have it in him to give it back to him.

Robin's being unfair and not looking past his own feelings. Hell, in Robin's book the only one, besides Tony, ALLOWED feelings his, well, himself.

He needs to be smacked down.

::big hugs::

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Yeah, right now, Alexis still going, "The who in the what now?" It'll pass eventually when he figures out why Robin is on the attack. He can be perceptive when he tries.

[jic]

Not blonde.

Take a deep breath. I know nothing of the situation, but from reading the comments, the only thing that can be done, you have done: be sincere and honest.

When bad things happen, I close off, back away, and do the polite thing while burying my feelings. This is probably unhealthy. Hence the over-share today.

Do you have a spiritual advisor/director/counselor? Someone with whom you can share, consult, weep.... When I finally finish writing up this Cursillo, you'll see why I recommend it.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Used to have a therapist, but that was when I had insurance. Eventually, I'll try to find something, but I'm so busy right now. It's crazy.

[jic]

Priests are free. I wouldn't recommend you latch onto the first one you come to, though - unless he or she serendipitously has the vibe that you can relate to.