Lord of the Rings - Virtues and names and tears

[butterfly]

So, tonight, I'm finally going to tackle my comments and then... my flist. It's been a while, so it's kinda scary.

But before that, I've had yet more thoughts on Lord of the Rings, which I'm more and more thinking of as one long-ass movie. All cut-tags will contain spoilers for Return of the King (and as a general note: I don't consider it necessesary to cut-tag something from a book that's been out forever - however, I do think that it's polite to help those who want to see the film vision pure, and therefore, I cut out of respect and caring.)

Rewatching Return once again brought home to me what a very spiritual story Lord is. There are three virtues that stand out most to me in the film - hope, mercy, and humility.

Oddly enough, that brings to mind the fact that there are four hobbits. And of those four, three can easily slip into defining a virtue - Frodo as mercy, Pippin as hope, and Sam as humility - and I think that if we should receive the full tale of Merry in the EE of Return that another virtue will present itself. For as a whole, these things point to spiritual love - agape.

Mercy, hope, and humility are what ultimately win the day - Frodo's mercy to Smeagol enables Gollum to later attack him for the ring; Pippin brings news of the enemy's plans, lights the beacon, saves Faramir, and thus is the reason that Minas Tirith regained hope; and Sam held to his love for Frodo and to his part in the tale, knowing that he wasn't meant to carry Frodo's burden. I remember reading once on my flist that Sam is servile, which I disagree with above all things. Sam is a servant, in the way that most with great wisdom and great love tend to be.



In Return, I counted five times that Sam said 'Frodo' instead of 'Mr. Frodo'. But it's possible that I may have missed a couple, as the scenes just suck me in.

Anyway, time the first - holding Frodo in the aftermath of Shelob's attack, Sam first says, 'Mr. Frodo', then 'Frodo', then 'Mr. Frodo' again.
Time the second - "This is for Frodo" in the tower of Cirth Ungol.
Time the third and fourth - Sam twice says 'Frodo' when the Eye has them in its gaze.
Time the fifth - just after Sam gets through the doorway into the mountain - he calls for 'Frodo'.



Does anyone remember if Frodo cries during Towers? I can't think of an occasion.

In Return, he cries twice - once inside Mt. Doom, just before he gives into the ring, and last outside, when he's accepted their death 'at the end of all things'.

Also, it's interesting how Return echoes Fellowship - Sam pulls Frodo out of the reach of the fire, as Frodo pulled him out of the water. And then, there's the difference in what Frodo says.

In Fellowship, he says, "I'm glad you're with me" while in Return, it's shifted to "I'm glad to be with you".

Comments

[cracknanny.livejournal.com]

Also, it's interesting how Return echoes Fellowship - Sam pulls Frodo out of the reach of the fire, as Frodo pulled him out of the water. And then, there's the difference in what Frodo says.

In Fellowship, he says, "I'm glad you're with me" while in Return, it's shifted to "I'm glad to be with you".

This is fascinating. And a great connection.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Thanks. And in addition to the differences, it's significant that both occurred because Sam refused to give up. Come hell or high water.

[katie-m.livejournal.com]

Also, it's interesting how Return echoes Fellowship

Sam and Frodo at the Cracks of Doom also very closely echo the view we get of Elrond and Isildur at the beginning of Fellowship. Either Isildur's actor is echoing Frodo's expression, or vice versa, too - it's very familiar.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Ah, so true. That horrible, creepy, and altogether soul-chilling smile that both Frodo and Isildur adopt after they claim ownership of the ring.

[taelonmahal.livejournal.com]

In Return, I counted five times that Sam said 'Frodo' instead of 'Mr. Frodo'.

In Fellowship, he says, "I'm glad you're with me" while in Return, it's shifted to "I'm glad to be with you".

I hadn't noticed these things. Thanks for pointing them out. :)

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

The reason I tried counting was because someone, somewhere (can't remember if it was on flist or on a board) was upset because they thought Sam only ever used "Mr. Frodo" and there was no just "Frodo" in the movie. And there was, just in the most intimate and powerful of moments - making it, I think, more special.

And you're very welcome. It's hard to pay attention to the specifics - I keep getting distracted by the emotion and power of it all.

[taelonmahal.livejournal.com]

It's hard to pay attention to the specifics - I keep getting distracted by the emotion and power of it all.

Oh yes! The first time I was very distracted and just too nervous, so that when I saw it the second time there were scenes during which I thought: "Wait, this wasn't in the movie I saw a few days ago!" - Thanks to people like you, who are pointing details out, I will hopefully notice even more things during my third viewing. :)

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Ooo - pay attention to the hobbit's expressions in the 'you bow to no one' bit. They're all so perfectly in tune with each character. These actors are so perfect (I only wish there were more Merry, so that I could feel as close to him as I do with the other three, more featured hobbits).

I've seen it four times, and I've definitely plans to see it more.

[taelonmahal.livejournal.com]

(I only wish there were more Merry, so that I could feel as close to him as I do with the other three, more featured hobbits)

Yes. I already didn't feel too connected with Merry when I read the books. I don't know what it is about him. I loved Frodo and Sam so dearly and I was so shocked when Pippin was assumed dead at the Black Gate... - but for Merry I never felt that much. I wish the movie would change that. Or rather: the EE.


I've seen it four times, and I've definitely plans to see it more.

I need more money. *looks around in the room* Well, maybe if I sell this chair and my bed... ;)

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I think the problem is that Merry doesn't change as much. We don't see him grow quite as much. He takes almost the same path as Pippin, but in a less extreme way (which actually would make sense in my whole "the four hobbits are four virtues" and faith is the most invisible of those virtues - much more an internal knowing than acting as the other three are... hmm. I may actually have to write that essay.)

Well, I used to order pizza and now, I eat cheap things and see LotR. Hee. Probably healthier all around.

[ink-gypsy.livejournal.com]

Does anyone remember if Frodo cries during Towers? I can't think of an occasion.

In the scene where Sam saves him from the Ringwraiths and Frodo, in his Ring madness, pulls a sword on him, I can't say for certain that he cried, but when Sam is giving his "worth fighting for" speech, I could swear Frodo had tears in his eyes. Kind of welled up, and just shy of falling, but there nonetheless. Unless it was my imagination.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I'll have to rewatch. I have a thought playing around in my mind and it would change depending on whether or... hmm. Actually, if he does, that would actually still work with my theory.

[monanotlisa.livejournal.com]

The hobbits as allegories for mercy, humility, hope, and faith-- loving it.

Especially Frodo as mercy-- it is the thread his story is woven with, from the very beginning to the very end:
Remember how Bilbo took in this little orphan after his parents died under tragic circumstances? The heated discussion Gandalf and Frodo have in the dark depths of Moria? Gollum, more than once.
And, of course, the final pages of The Return of the King, that is, the scene the deletion of which I cannot quite forgive Peter Jackson: Frodo sparing Saruman's and wormtongue's life, thus breaking the cycle of death, revenge, and ultimately, their evil power over others is one of my favourite moments of the books and has always resonated deeply within me.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

The hobbits as allegories for mercy, humility, hope, and faith-- loving it.

It's really something that I'm thinking about quite seriously. When next I watch Fellowship, I'm going to watch them not just as themselves, but as these four things and see how well it works (two things immediately pop to mind - Galadriel tells Pippin - "You will find your courage." while Eowyn tells Merry - "Courage for our friends." - hope and faith).

And yeah, Frodo is the essence of mercy, not just given, but received. Gandalf cites 'pity' but Frodo's sparing of Gollum is not that alone - he sees himself in Gollum - he sees why Gollum is Gollum - he sees Smeagol. Bilbo may have been showing pity, but Frodo was not.

I wonder how the Scouring would have turned out, but I'm not sure that it was needed - we saw Frodo sparing Gollum's life and we saw Gandalf spare Saruman's. We saw Wormtongue cry at the sight of the armies of Isengard.