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I'm a hero-person. I like the hero. I tend to assume that the hero is just as complicated as the rest of the characters. And I really identified with Clark at the end of Dichotic.

He gets called to the Talon. When he gets there, once again he is insulted for trying to help, for saving lives. Lana says that they need to make their own mistakes, but their mistake would have lead to them getting very dead. They start out apologizing for not trusting him, but they qualify it.

I mean, no wonder the guy goes Superman/Clark Kent. You can't both save lives and keep secrets, apparently. So, create two lives, one where all you do is save lives and the other where no one thinks to ask you all those questions that can only hurt both parties because you can't answer them.

So, he comes to the Talon, gets told off, but this time, instead of taking it, he tells them off in turn. Stop treating me like I'm jealous. I've always been right about this in the past. Trust me to save you, because that's all I can give you.

The same thing happens to Buffy. She keeps getting told that she's seeing demons where there's just life, but when you fight these things, you get an instinct for it. She's never been wrong.

Neither has Clark. And people should take that into account when they judge him.

Is it annoying that he's always right about this kinda thing? To some people, yeah. But that doesn't mean that he's not right. He was right about Justin. He was right about Whitney (re: attacking Kyle). He was right about Desiree. He was right about Byron.

And he didn't start acting off about Ian until he saw him macking on Lana, after he'd seen him macking on Chloe. He didn't get upset until he realized that Ian was playing the girls.

My instinctive, off the cuff response to the moment at the end was pride. Clark stood up for himself. And while that may or may not get washed away by next week's episode, at the moment, he's grown. He stood up for himself, openly declared that all he was doing was helping them, and he was proud of himself for doing it.

I've felt similar moments of pride for my other heros. I'll never forget Buffy saying, "I'm Buffy, the Vampire Slayer, and you are?" Xander walking away from Cordelia at the end of The Zeppo is another moment. Benton Fraser, talking his father into not taking revenge. Doyle, repeating that you never really know what you're capable of until you're tested, punching out Angel and redeeming himself in a blaze of light.

Clark never stands up for himself. He lets everyone diss him, because he feels guilty for everything. And finally, he decides that he isn't the only one who's caused pain and he isn't the only one who's sent mixed signals. It's not all his fault and he's not going to let them convince him that it is. Character growth is pretty.

(no subject)

Date: 2002-11-21 06:55 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] elynross.livejournal.com
You can't imagine how glad I am you did post this in your journal! And I think I'm in love. Will you marry me? I'm not usually this forward, but heros! And Clark!

I'm a hero-person. I like the hero. I tend to assume that the hero is just as complicated as the rest of the characters.

Yes, yes, yes. This is what gets me confused: so many people talk as if doing the right thing is easy, that the hero does it without thought, without doubt, without complexity. I've never understood that.

So, create two lives, one where all you do is save lives and the other where no one thinks to ask you all those questions that can only hurt both parties because you can't answer them.

I had this feeling, too -- as I said to you before, and it was confirmed on rewatching the scene last night, it seems to me that this isn't so much what he wants, necessarily, as how he decides it needs to be. If nothing else, at the moment life is possibly just too complicated to try and juggle his expanding powers, his secrets, his home life, and a love life. And now he has Pete, anyway. Um, not referencing lovelife, here, but he has that outlet, someone who knows, that he can let off steam to, talk to, and not have to hide from.

You can't both save lives and keep secrets, apparently.

I can see Clark starting to think this now, definitely, since all trying to get closer has gotten him is grief. It made me kind of sad, his look on leaving the Talon, because it was a more mature look, a resolved look, but I'd hate to think that he'd decide so young that ultimately, he has to be alone.

So, he comes to the Talon, gets told off, but this time, instead of taking it, he tells them off in turn. Stop treating me like I'm jealous. I've always been right about this in the past. Trust me to save you, because that's all I can give you.

Guh. Just-- guh. I love this. And the thing is, they're all right, you know? Yes, in some ways I can see why Lana and Chloe didn't want to listen -- maybe in part because Clark always has been right, and maybe because Clark has never fought for either of them. He's seemed to want them, but always backed off when they put up barriers, or took them at face value when they said, as Chloe did, that maybe they should back away. He has too many fights going on to read minds and prove what he wants to satisfy their insecurities, and too much honor, I think, to press something when he's told it isn't wanted. Well, and he's very young, and how's he supposed to know "go away" means "come closer?"

As well, it looked to me like they were getting ready to force him to make a choice, or declare his feelings, or tell him off -- who can blame him for backing off first? Like he said, it can't be good.

Clark never stands up for himself. He lets everyone diss him, because he feels guilty for everything. And finally, he decides that he isn't the only one who's caused pain and he isn't the only one who's sent mixed signals. It's not all his fault and he's not going to let them convince him that it is. Character growth is pretty.

I mashed this together, but I had to repeat all of it, because I just love it. It's very true! He feels guilty, and he knows that he has lied, and misled, and concealed, so how can he make any claims, justify himself? He's starting to realize that if he's going to be the man he can be, that he and his parents can all be proud of, and that will allow him to protect those he loves, he can't share everything, and that he's not doing it out of a lack of trust, or malice, or anything that he has to be ashamed of. Sure, sometimes he goofs, and it's not going to be easy, but often doing the right thing comes at a sacrifice, and not everyone is going to like you, or how you do things.

Doyle, repeating that you never really know what you're capable of until you're tested, punching out Angel and redeeming himself in a blaze of light.

I so, so miss Doyle. I love that scene, and even more, the tag where Cordy is watching his tape. "Is that it? Am I done?" sob

(no subject)

Date: 2002-11-21 01:03 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
This is what gets me confused: so many people talk as if doing the right thing is easy, that the hero does it without thought, without doubt, without complexity.

Yeah. Doing the right thing? Is hard. Many people just float along the path of least resistance, and while you can argue that Clark has done that romantically, he hasn't done it heroically. Because he didn't have to worry about what Ian playing the girls meant, but he did, because he knows... well, for starters, he knows that almost every mutant that they've come across has turned homicidal. He knows that mutantness can happen immediately. And he knew that someone odd was happening. I'm sure that, at first, he just thought it was the two-timing, but later, I mean, he's not surprised anymore when people turn out to be homicidal freaks.

Which is a shame, when you think about it. Will he eventually start assuming that anyone new is a killer, simply because it's hard to think of anyone who hasn't been? I've got Jessie, and that's about it.

And now he has Pete, anyway. Um, not referencing lovelife, here, but he has that outlet, someone who knows, that he can let off steam to, talk to, and not have to hide from.

That must be a tremendous relief. In fact, that might be part of why he basically shrugs away what Ryan says about Pete feeling stressed over his secret. He doesn't want to think that he was wrong to tell Pete. That it might have been too much. Ignore the mind-reader, he's saying things you don't want to hear.

Which reminds me of Cassandra. Everything in that episode that related to that episode came true, yes? The graveyard and Lex's (unseen) vision were both future event-type stuff, and seemed more symbolic than factual. I wonder if Clark ever thinks about that dream?

I can see Clark starting to think this now, definitely, since all trying to get closer has gotten him is grief. It made me kind of sad, his look on leaving the Talon, because it was a more mature look, a resolved look, but I'd hate to think that he'd decide so young that ultimately, he has to be alone.

This kind of stuff makes me hopeful that Smallville will show us the evolution of Superman. Show us how and when he decided that he needed to save people in a costume, and also to make his... Clarkness a dork. Because he's not a (huge) dork right now, so does he enhance that image over time, so that, when he reaches Metropolis, it's believeable to anyone who knew him in SV?

Guh. Just-- guh. I love this. And the thing is, they're all right, you know? Yes, in some ways I can see why Lana and Chloe didn't want to listen -- maybe in part because Clark always has been right, and maybe because Clark has never fought for either of them... He has too many fights going on to read minds and prove what he wants to satisfy their insecurities, and too much honor, I think, to press something when he's told it isn't wanted. Well, and he's very young, and how's he supposed to know "go away" means "come closer?"

Especially when they're two of his four friends. I can totally see why he'd think that the friendship was ages better than pushing.

As well, it looked to me like they were getting ready to force him to make a choice, or declare his feelings, or tell him off -- who can blame him for backing off first? Like he said, it can't be good.

Word. They were working up to something and I'm glad that he derailed them.

Sure, sometimes he goofs, and it's not going to be easy, but often doing the right thing comes at a sacrifice, and not everyone is going to like you, or how you do things.

And sometimes, doing the right thing makes people mad at you. Like you pointed out, probably part of the reason that L&C are annoyed is because Clark is always right about this stuff. And that would a horrible thing for Clark for face. I mean, people aren't supposed to get mad that you're doing the right thing. But sometimes they do.

I so, so miss Doyle. I love that scene, and even more, the tag where Cordy is watching his tape. "Is that it? Am I done?"

Doyle was a great character. He was on the show for nine episodes and he's still loved and missed by many people and we're in the fourth season. Great character.

(no subject)

Date: 2002-12-05 12:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] elynross.livejournal.com
Which is a shame, when you think about it. Will he eventually start assuming that anyone new is a killer, simply because it's hard to think of anyone who hasn't been?

Hmmm. I don't know, but I kind of doubt it. Even with Ian, he doesn't spring out with what he's seen until he has a chance to test it. He doesn't tell Chloe, "I heard him make plans to stay with Lana," he just lets her tell him off, and sets it up so he can test what's going on.

The graveyard and Lex's (unseen) vision were both future event-type stuff, and seemed more symbolic than factual. I wonder if Clark ever thinks about that dream?

I'm sure he does. I haven't really thought about it, but I wonder what it means to him? In context of saving people, here are all these graves of people he possibly won't save...

In fact, that might be part of why he basically shrugs away what Ryan says about Pete feeling stressed over his secret. He doesn't want to think that he was wrong to tell Pete.

Oh, now, that's an interesting thought. He does a similar kind of thing with Ryan's warnings and comments re: Lex. And yet we also know that Clark doesn't seem to be someone who ultimately hides his head in the sand.

Because he's not a (huge) dork right now, so does he enhance that image over time, so that, when he reaches Metropolis, it's believeable to anyone who knew him in SV?

Well, we have gotten some asides that indicate that he's seen as kind of a dork *g*. I'm betting he's got kind of a goody-two-shoes rep, and he's not one of the popular kids. And if he is pretty much always right about things... It might not take that much to grow up into someone that people kind of take for granted, care about but don't notice that much, maybe?

(no subject)

Date: 2002-12-05 04:15 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Even with Ian, he doesn't spring out with what he's seen until he has a chance to test it. He doesn't tell Chloe, "I heard him make plans to stay with Lana," he just lets her tell him off, and sets it up so he can test what's going on.

Good point. I was being a bit of a Drama Queen there. "And Soon! Clark Will Never Trust! Again!" Clark's smarter than that.

And yet we also know that Clark doesn't seem to be someone who ultimately hides his head in the sand.

So what will be the turning point? M&G, this is why we find the idea of the show interesting! Explore! How! Clark! Becomes! Superman!

I'm betting he's got kind of a goody-two-shoes rep, and he's not one of the popular kids.

Probably true. Still, wouldn't the whole Red saga put a serious dent in that image. Then again, school-wise, he only really acted out with Jessieplotdevice and LanawhoonlywantstheTruth. Still, he was seriously strutting around there for a while. He did the motorcycle thing. I guess people might just pass off as the shortest teen rebellion ever.

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