butterfly: (Naked Angel)
[personal profile] butterfly

You never know what shape the story will take until the end. You can guess, but until it's all over and the story is finished, it's impossible to be certain.

Once somebody said, I don't remember who and, hell, it could even have been me -- once somebody said that Buffy was about faith and Angel was about hope.

Angel has always had an element of uncertainty, an appealing unstability that Buffy lacks. Angel is about balancing on the knife's edge every single day and always being able to feel the blade pressing against your skin.

Buffy ended at the end of a fight, with the beginning of a new future -- Buffy continues on an open road, changing the world.

Angel ended in the middle of a fight, in the middle of the night -- Angel continues into an alley, fighting to make each moment something to remember.

Lindsey died and I gasped, but I wasn't surprised at the manner of his death. Lindsey was always an afterthought to Angel. Lindsey wouldn't have wanted anyone to kill Angel but himself, but Angel is willing to delegate Lindsey's death. That fits with their relationship. Lindsey died and the only person mourning him almost certainly died when the Wolfram and Hart building fell. He had to die -- Angel signed away the shanshu and Lindsey has always been entangled in that. Destiny falls.

Lorne left, but he was never a part of the group in the same way the rest of them were -- he wasn't, as he pointed out, a fighter. Lorne was willing to kill for Angel and then it was over. Lorne was the only person that Angel could have given that job to, but giving him that job broke him. "This is what we do now." And Lorne doesn't want to live in that kind of violence. That's why he left Pylea. Knowledge kills destiny and abandons ship. Hope lives in the space past knowledge, past what can be read.

Harmony survived and I'm not shocked. She is, above all else, a survivor. And Angel knew what she was every single day that he didn't kill her. He always knew. He planned for it -- he had no reason to curse her sudden yet inevitable betrayal. She's the soulless vampire. Angel lives at the end, Angelus lives, and so does she.

Connor lives and I'm exceedingly happy about that. Once, I called him the embodiment of Angel's hope. I still think of him that way. Angel's hope lives. As long as Connor survives, as long as hope survives, Angel's death will be worthy.

Gunn has perhaps ten minutes to live at the end of the show, by Illyria's reckoning. I trust her judgement in this situation. He was the one to wonder where Wesley was. Gunn is about to die, as the show closes, yet he fights to make the moment worth remembering. Mission is alive for the moment but carries a mortal wound.

Illyria is Fred is emotion. Is grief and violence. She lives, she fights, she mourns. She is the inhumanity that loves. Emotion lives to continue fighting, but transformed and sorrowful and inrevokably changed by the fighting and the pain of the past years.

Spike also joins in the final fight, the twin souled vampire. All of the survivors are there because they survive in Angel. Because they chose to stay with him and he chose to keep them. Spike is, of course, the soul -- the goldfish.

Wesley died (there was weeping). But I wasn't surprised at the manner of his death. Wesley is so very complicated. Call him mind, that is not enough. Call him mission and that is not accurate. Someone called him Angel's humanity (TBQ?). This is something that I can agree to. So, like Lindsey, he had to die, because Angel signed away all hope of gaining his humanity. Angel can't remember being human anymore.

Oh, Angel.

Would-be Slayer of Dragons.

Angel, I have loved.
From: [identity profile] raveninthewind.livejournal.com
I always preferred Angel to Buffy because it was more complex, more adult, and colored in shades of gray.

I didn't like the ending. I loved some of the moments when the characters' true selves shone out. But overall, it wasn't satisfying.

Maybe I'll change my mind once time has passed and I see it again with less emotional reaction. (I was completely unspoiled.)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
I always preferred Angel to Buffy because it was more complex, more adult, and colored in shades of gray.

I love them both, but for very different reasons. BtVS is about finding the light at the end of the tunnel. AtS is about fighting even when you can't remember what light looks like anymore.

I didn't like the ending. I loved some of the moments when the characters' true selves shone out. But overall, it wasn't satisfying.

I wouldn't call myself satisfied. I hate the WB. There's massive amounts of angst and pain and... my show is dead. I'm not satisfied with the ending, but I wouldn't be satisfied with anything less than a sixth season. I like the anger and grief and fighting spirit that the episode ended on because that's how I feel about Angel ending.

Maybe I'll change my mind once time has passed and I see it again with less emotional reaction. (I was completely unspoiled.)

I was unspoiled, too. There much "They killed Wes. They killed Wes? They killed Wes!"

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:30 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kita0610.livejournal.com
Angel can't remember being human anymore.
Oh, Angel.
Would-be Slayer of Dragons.
Angel, I have loved.
***

Ah fuck.

I'm crying again. My boy. My big, stupid, hero.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:39 am (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
He really was a big damn hero there at the end. I have never loved him more than when he claimed dibs on the dragon.

That's my boy.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:46 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fallingfortruth.livejournal.com
I totally agree. It was the best of both Angel and Angelus... You're going to go down, but you'll go down fighting and with a big shit eating grin on your face.

God do I love my dead gay show.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:50 am (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
He finally accepted himself. So long and he finally accepted all of himself. I love that being a vampire is what let him kill Hamilton. So much. And he just uses it and he's and then... and the end...

*sniffles*

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fallingfortruth.livejournal.com
I totally feel your pain. Being in the college net lab is the only thing keeping me from sobbing my eyes out right now.

Also? You icon is very, very nice. I think I'll just stare at it for a while.

(And also-also? I friended you. People who do intellegent commentary is a big thing of mine)

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 07:28 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Naked Angel is a balm to weary eyes.

(and thank you. I've very flattered.)

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:42 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kita0610.livejournal.com
I swiped that poetry there at the end for my cut tag, credited you. Hope it's ok. It was just...perfect.

God. My boy. Champion? Hell. yes.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:44 am (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Oh, I don't mind at all. Very flattered.

And Angel looked lovely in the rain.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:46 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kita0610.livejournal.com
It always rains on Angel.

I think that's one of the reasons I love him so damn much.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:55 am (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
It always rains on Angel.

I think that's one of the reasons I love him so damn much.


Yes. Because it rains on him, he gets wet, and he keeps going.

Keeps fighting.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 06:57 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] inyron.livejournal.com
YES, especially to the Lindsey/Wesley/Shanshu parts.

Also, dude. "Angel continues into an alley." He chose that spot, for the final fight. The alley. Where it all began.

I think I teared up at the fact that it was the alley by the *Hyperion,* too.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 07:29 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Hamilton said it -- Angel started as gutter trash.

That's our guy, always fighting from the gutter.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 07:41 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eva-mac.livejournal.com
Just when I think I can't cry anymore, I read incredibly thought-provoking, insightful, lyrical, and emotional commentary like yours. Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts, and especially for giving Wesley's death thematic meaning. It's so frustrating when characters die for the purposes of pathos or a body count - your explanation stopped the hair-tearing. (But not the wracking sobs.)

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 07:32 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Oh, I've been waiting for Wesley to die. I love him so much and Joss didn't kill Xander, so I've been expecting Wesley to be killed.

Wesley was the person most broken by Angel and I'm glad that he died with some peace, died in a way he found acceptable. He was so broken, at the end.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 07:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bhadrasvapna.livejournal.com
once somebody said that Buffy was about faith and Angel was about hope

That would probably be me. I write about it often enough. I wrote more about it before I had an LJ. I wanted Jasmine to be hope and not just some lame plot device that took away free will.

One thing though, Angel does remember being human. Four years ago, with Buffy laying on him listening to that heart beat. Harmony brought up the feel of her heart beating when she kissed a cute guy for the first time. This is IWRY. The Oracles said he would have to bear the burden of that day. When Angel signed away his hope at Shanshu, he knew what he was giving up. The burden of that day was most strongly felt probably two times in Angel's life--sitting beneath a tree holding Buffy in "Forever" and looking out the window last night.

I loved the Dragon. Angel can slay the beast that came to this world in "The Gift."

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 07:36 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
That would probably be me. I write about it often enough. I wrote more about it before I had an LJ. I wanted Jasmine to be hope and not just some lame plot device that took away free will.

I'm fine with Jasmine not being hope, because the second that Angel actually had a kid... well, that is the only chance for aware immortality that an atheist believes in.

One thing though, Angel does remember being human. Four years ago, with Buffy laying on him listening to that heart beat. Harmony brought up the feel of her heart beating when she kissed a cute guy for the first time. This is IWRY. The Oracles said he would have to bear the burden of that day. When Angel signed away his hope at Shanshu, he knew what he was giving up. The burden of that day was most strongly felt probably two times in Angel's life--sitting beneath a tree holding Buffy in "Forever" and looking out the window last night.

I'm not sure that he feels it remembers it. He probably can't conjure up the feeling of it -- not because the actual time has been so long, but because in emotional time, he's lived centuries since that moment.

I loved the Dragon. Angel can slay the beast that came to this world in "The Gift."

And he just might -- he still has Hamilton's blood in his veins.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-20 09:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] roguewords.livejournal.com
first, it's all [livejournal.com profile] boniblithe's fault that I came here.
second, I'm friending you.
third, I'm crying again.

wow. just wow.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-21 09:03 am (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Thank you.

goldfish?

Date: 2004-05-21 02:44 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] trepkos.livejournal.com
"Spike also joins in the final fight, the twin souled vampire. All of the survivors are there because they survive in Angel. Because they chose to stay with him and he chose to keep them. Spike is, of course, the soul -- the goldfish."
I'm sure I'm being thick, but, why is Spike a goldfish?

Re: goldfish?

Date: 2004-05-21 07:05 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Soul Purpose -- Angel's soul is a goldfish in his dream, so mainly it's a way of amusing myself to call Spike a goldfish.

Re: goldfish?

Date: 2004-05-21 07:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] trepkos.livejournal.com
I'll have to re-watch that when the videos come out - I've only seen it on Net download so far, and that bit passed me by!
So, you think Spike is Angel's soul? Well, he has enough to share.

Re: goldfish?

Date: 2004-05-21 07:52 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Symbolic of Angel's soul, definitely. Which was the problem for Angel -- he didn't have anyone on his show who stood for his soul -- Buffy was still in Sunnydale. He couldn't be complete until all the pieces were in place.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-22 09:38 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] joshy.livejournal.com
Ugh. I spent most of yesterday (when I saw the episode) sobbling and sniffling. You just started me off again. Thanks :) One of the things I'll miss about the Buffyverse is reading your thoughts on the new eps.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-22 02:50 pm (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
*pets*

Thank you and you're very welcome.

I'm really going to miss writing about new episodes. But at least the show is partly out on dvd already, with the rest coming out. I've definitely not written anywhere near my last Buffyverse essay.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-26 11:57 pm (UTC)
ext_1771: Joe Flanigan looking A-Dorable. (Default)
From: [identity profile] monanotlisa.livejournal.com
Buffy was about faith and Angel was about hope.

Ambling over from [livejournal.com profile] melymbrosia's lj, I find this most interesting and actually a bit amusing as she says almost the opposite:

Buffy is about hope [...] Angel is about the redemption of wrongs, the atonement for the past.

Which strikes a chord deep inside me; and I actually think this is true for BtVS and can be applied to all seasons of AtS--

save for the last. In Season Five, Angel finally rids himself of the cross he'd chosen to bear not long after a certain incident in the Romanian hills-- to be more precise, at the end of the Jasmine arc, he is beginning to turn, slowly stopping to look at the past and realising the future. Jasmine's world was a perversion even in Angel's eyes, but nevertheless, it is foreshadowing Angel's decision to build his new universe on a lie to save the one person he loved more than anything.

Wolfram & Hart could only further a different perspective, so his flailings and failings in the beginning of the season actually puzzled me. Redemption and the past did not seem to be determining factors in Angel's shiny glass-and-steel kingdom, and while anything but an internal and external struggle wouldn't have been credible, his long inability to act instead of react seemed...well, not out of character but definitely very drawn out.

Anyway. Hope. I think you are right-- by the time Angel starts weaving the threads of his rebellion (an inverted Lucifer, if you will), the shanshu carrot of redemption isn't what drives him any more-- don't get me wrong, when he gives it up, he gives up his *life* which is, obviously, a great and wonderful thing...but it's not the same as giving up his *unlife* later in that alley.

The message is both old and new-- it's the one he's stating in his speech to his friends, the same one Anne gives Gunn: Even if it is meaningless in the face of eternity-- especially if it is meaningless in the face of eternity--, the now and the immediate future is what, ultimately, matters: We have to fight. We have to stand up. Because just as the Senior Partners will never die, Angel and his friends and their actions will be immortal.

Angel can't remember being human anymore.

Yes. I think he couldn't for a very long time but kept hoping he would regain it-- a hope that he finally gave up. Literally.

Thanks for a gorgeous review.

(no subject)

Date: 2004-05-28 08:38 am (UTC)
ext_1774: butterfly against blue background (Default)
From: [identity profile] butterfly.livejournal.com
Wolfram & Hart could only further a different perspective, so his flailings and failings in the beginning of the season actually puzzled me. Redemption and the past did not seem to be determining factors in Angel's shiny glass-and-steel kingdom, and while anything but an internal and external struggle wouldn't have been credible, his long inability to act instead of react seemed...well, not out of character but definitely very drawn out.

Angel as Hamlet. Hmm.

And thank you for your response. I definitely agree with a lot of it.

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