Bang.

[butterfly]

The reason I wrote this post is actually because all the kerfluffling over what Joss said on the Angel season five commentaries (about Angel and Spike totally having fucked at points in their past -- I'm paraphrasing a bit, of course).

Just made me start to think about this radical notion of 'gay cred' as something that Joss might be trying to claim. As if the wider world would see it as an honor.

If you're new, you may not know that I'm queer. Bisexual, if we need to be specific.

And the idea that being gay has become at all acceptable... being treated like a toy in mainstream media is not acceptance, thank you.

I just recently watched Queer as Folk 2 and I can't help but identify with Stuart. I feel like a caged tiger some days, pacing around and around, wearing a hole in the floor. God, whenever I see one of those Measure 36 bumper stickers, with that oh, so clever, slogan, "One Man. One Woman." on it, slapped on a car, it makes me feel like a fucking second-class citizen. And that pisses me off a whole fucking lot.

I'm not Stuart but his words are sticking in my head. Months go, I told off one person for using 'gay' as an insult. Only time that it's come up in my presence. It's not enough, not when I read the news and...

How can people hate so much because of something so stupid? I don't understand.

I want to break things and the only thing that I end up breaking is myself. I just feel this inarticulate rage that I can't... I've even gotten mad at my mom, though I don't show it to her. But knowing that my mom, my liberal 'I have gay friends' mom, that she believes that I'm only playing with the idea of being bisexual because I 'feel sorry for them', it really just makes my heart twist in my chest.

Once, my dad got drunk and mentioned to his new wife's family that he doesn't know any gay people (I think I mentioned that on here). I've told him. But he never heard me. I've told him more than once and he just didn't listen.

Because it isn't trendy. It's used as a cheap trick on shows sometimes, as a 'shock tactic', but that doesn't make it popular. Not here, in the US. And even less so recently. So, yeah, I admire Joss Whedon a whole hell of a lot for Larry, for Willow and Tara, and for Angel. People think that he didn't go far enough?

Nothing I can do feels like enough. But what would be enough?

When a day comes that people look at other people and don't see skin or sex or sexuality, but just other people, then, it'll have been enough. And I look at the news, at those stupid immoral and unconstitutional measures, at all the homophobic bullshit that we're dealing with at the moment, and it's so hard to believe that that day will ever come.

Shylock's speech in The Merchant of Venice breaks my heart, because it's so easy for a detested minority to work up that kind of rage, that kind of hate. Where you feel so spit upon and hated that you would do anything to get your 'pound of flesh'. I can see myself there. I hate it, but I can.

I don't like being angry but I'm not going to hide, to pretend that I'm not attracted to women.

Most teen girls who watched Buffy identified with the character who wanted the cute and geeky boy. I identified with the one who wanted the hot blonde. Long before I had a clue that I liked women, it was there in my subconscious.

Over the past few years, I've been slowly growing into myself. My mom asked me, after I told her, how I could possibly know, when I hadn't kissed a girl. I just asked her how she'd known that she liked boys.

What I wanted to say then, but wasn't ready to, was that I know because I look at women and picture them naked, same as I do with guys. I actually can tell sexual attraction from 'aesthetic admiration'.

Bigotry may very well be my 'trump' issue, the thing that matters more than anything else. And right now, homophobia is being practiced as part of state policy. Bigotry is legal in Oregon because of Measure 36. Because marriage is sacred and if queers were allowed to get married, everyone would be fucking dogs next.

Mom said, after hearing how passionate I was about the election results, that she never expected me to become a political activist. And while I'm not -- I donate money to a few groups, it's not the same thing -- I think I'm headed that way. I'm caring more about doing something and less about consequences, as the time passes. It digs a little more deeply each time.

Before the election, I lived in a bit of a dream world. I wasn't aware of just how many people believed that my having a physical attraction to another woman magically made me a less worthy person. Now, I'm hyper aware and I can't shut it off.

I don't want to shut it off, to close my eyes. Because if I did, it would still be happening and I would be doing nothing to fight it.

Like Angel, I'd rather fight, even if it looks like it's not doing any good. Because taking a stand and showing them that you won't go quietly does mean something, even if there are impossible odds.

Even if you don't slay the dragon, it's better than not trying.

Comments

[trepkos.livejournal.com]

Nothing to add except, right there with you.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Thanks. It's frustrating, but it helps to know that I'm not alone in my frustration.

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

I asked, in Kindkit's LJ, for some kind of reasonable explanation for the notion of "queer cred"- because uh, yea. Where does one line up for that? I got an answer, but by no means a reasonable explanation.

So. Word?

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I read all those posts and comments and just couldn't write a coherent response in any sort of reasonable way. I had to sit down and just write and edit and think and by that time, it wasn't a reponse but a post by itself.

Really, I'm just 'word'ing you, but using a lot of space to do it. It's all so intensely frustrating, yeah?

[teaphile.livejournal.com]

Yup. This is about the only issue I get political about.

I just asked her how she'd known that she liked boys.

I used a version of that on my dad once. He was ranting about 'if they choose to be gay they don't deserve [I believe spousal benefits was the issue at hand]'. I told him no one chooses to be gay, any more than he made a conscious choice to be straight. It shut him up for a little while. I think that was the first time he ever really showed me the bigot he is about sexuality (I've known since I was a child that he's a racial bigot). The next time he started in on the subject I had statistics to back me up.

Some day, during some argument, I'll lose my temper and come out to him as bi. Not that anyone will give me any credit as such considering that I'm married to a man, but it means something to me.

[emrinalexander.livejournal.com]

The problem we all run into, being bisexual, is that gay and lesbian friends think we're fence sitting and straight people think we're...yeh, sigh, fence sitting. It makes me want to stomp my feet and throw things at times.

I started using the "and just when did you decide to be straight?" question on people about a year ago, and it is amazing how it stops the ranters in their tracks - at least for a minute or two.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

We really do get a lot of shifty looks from both sides of the equation. Part of the reason that I identify myself as 'queer' first and 'bisexual' second. Queer's a more... inclusive word.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I've given up on talking to my dad. I've actually found out about his prejudices because he's a sci-fi fan as well, so I was there when he blew up over... a black male character sleeping with a white woman. But, apparently, that doesn't make him racist because he doesn't have any problems with black women and white men.

Just... it's the same shit with guys who are okay with lesbian porn but not with gay men. It just highlights the utter stupidity of their position.

[joshy.livejournal.com]

I can't say anything except thank you for being so eloquent and heartfelt. Especially in school where every moment people are calling things "sooo gayy, dude" it's easy to feel like giving up.

[fallingfortruth.livejournal.com]

*pets*

Although there are things I refer to as painfully gay. Most of which involve excessive fashion victimization.

But I also don't let anyone get away with sexuality-based bigotry in my general area. (You should know that, Joshling. *gropes*)

I am still waiting for you that striptease, young man.

*apologizes to *butterfly for hijacking her extremely well thought out rant*

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

You're welcome.

If what I see is bad, that kind of casual disregard has to be so incredibly frustrating (I'm using that word a lot). I don't live in an environment where that's used so much, so it really stands out when I do hear it.

And we can't give up or it'll swallow us. Terrifying, that. But as long as there's hope, there's life.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

You're not being political; you're standing up for yourself, which is something the average person does every day of their lives.

I'm queer, too, lesbian, and just avoiding the whole season 5 DVD commentary issue. I'll always be grateful to Joss for breaking the boundaries on the shows like he did, but all the debate on it to begin with--it shouldn't even be an issue.

But it is an issue. After the election, I made some changes in my life. Those election results really put the fire under my butt, not for political action, necessarily, but personal action. But since the personal is political, I'm making a statement in my own way.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I hate that it is such an issue, that my personal life has to be politics as well. But yes, the election really made me realise that I don't have a choice about that -- they've made personal life political with their laws. The only choice I have is to try to ignore them or to fight. And playing the ostrich won't help anyone, least of all myself.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

It's weird in a way because I lived a pretty sheltered life like you before the election. Just going about my life, surrounded by people who pretty much thought as I did on the issue, and not realizing the number of people who didn't.

It's easy, though, to remain complacent even in the face of that, though. In fact very easy. Life is less anxiety-provoking if you put your head in the sand.

I'm old enough to remember the sodomy laws in some states that declared that what I was doing in bed illegal, but gay life always went on despite those laws when I lived in those states. Even in sodomy law states, there were gay bars and bookstores and organizations just going about their daily business and I don't see any of that changing now. Until someone makes an issue of that.

What's required is for us all to realize that a "war" of sorts has been declared against queers by people who want to take things back to the way they were before the '70's, when you couldn't just go about your business and your life without being judged sick or in violation of the law.

Yeah, complacency is not gonna help.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

What's required is for us all to realize that a "war" of sorts has been declared against queers by people who want to take things back to the way they were before the '70's, when you couldn't just go about your business and your life without being judged sick or in violation of the law.

Exactly. If we ignore it, it'll keep getting worse. If we let stay, in law, that we're unequal, it gives them something to stand on.

All that evil requires is for good people to do nothing, to paraphrase a famous quote.

[masqthephlsphr.livejournal.com]

The problem is, gay people and liberals, etc (talking slightly different issues here, but I'm generalizing) have gotten used to things being a certain way and aren't even aware all of that is under attack yet, much less decided to stand up to it. It'll get worse before it gets better.

[nicole-anell.livejournal.com]

Woot. And hear hear. My mind's still boggling at this kerfuffle in general, because there are so many deeper issues than Angel and Spike going on here.

How can people hate so much because of something so stupid? I don't understand.
*hugs*? Right there with you. Glad we're still fighting.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

My mind's still boggling at this kerfuffle in general, because there are so many deeper issues than Angel and Spike going on here.

People are amazing to me in so many ways. All the contradictions and complications that make up each individual... it's astonishing that we manage to communicate at all, really. So, it isn't surprising to me how often people miscommunicate. Especially when people feel as though they're working from a defensive position. It's the cornered rat syndrome. Oftentimes, we're so used to being attacked that we see blood everywhere.

*hugs*? Right there with you. Glad we're still fighting.

*hugs back*

It's worth it. No matter what happens, we are right to keep fighting.

[ruedifference.livejournal.com]

Months go, I told off one person for using 'gay' as an insult. Only time that it's come up in my presence
Wow. I'd say I hear it 2 or 3 times a week, if not more. But, then again, I live in the Midwest.

Other than that? I'm just here to say that I thank you for your eloquence.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I live in Oregon. Bit more of a sheltered environment. Of course, even here, we had that bloody Measure 36 pass. Apparently, the bigots are just quieter (I never got around to asking my dad how he voted on that... I'm scared of the answer, I think).

I'm just here to say that I thank you for your eloquence.

You're welcome. It's just so... frustrating really does sum it up. Feels like I'm fighting to keep above quicksand. And a lot of this came out of watching QaF2 and being a bit terrified of just how on Stuart's side I am, that sometimes, "fuck off" isn't enough, because bigots don't. They aren't willing to live and let live, they have to dictate terms.

[fannishnonsense]

There's a kerfluffle over that? How'd I miss that one? Sometimes fandom just makes me so mad...

Anyway I just wanted to say that I totally agree. You always seems to put my own feelings into words so much better than I can.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

There's a kerfluffle over that? How'd I miss that one? Sometimes fandom just makes me so mad...

Fandom is such a microcosm of society. It delights me, frustrates me, disappoints me, pisses me off, and can even, on occasion, surprise me.

Anyway I just wanted to say that I totally agree. You always seems to put my own feelings into words so much better than I can.

Thank you.

[monanotlisa.livejournal.com]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I had, so far, missed the kerfuffle, and am beginning to think it's a good thing.

I can't count the times I've admonished or corrected people, and how often I've flat-out told them to not be discriminatory regarding queers-- and I live in a place where, really, it's not that big a deal or at least doesn't inspire hatred, just amusement and misunderstanding...

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I can't count the times I've admonished or corrected people, and how often I've flat-out told them to not be discriminatory regarding queers-- and I live in a place where, really, it's not that big a deal or at least doesn't inspire hatred, just amusement and misunderstanding...

Mostly, all we can do in our daily lives is the little things like that. I'm just not sure it's enough for me anymore, you know? The election really changed things for me.

Hi! Here via metafandom

[http://users.livejournal.com/tefnut_/]

What I wanted to say then, but wasn't ready to, was that I know because I look at women and picture them naked, same as I do with guys. I actually can tell sexual attraction from 'aesthetic admiration'.
Oh yeah I've heard that argument *so* often: "But when you're looking at a woman, it's only because you appreciate her beauty on an artistic level, or because you want to be like her, right?" Hell, no. When I look at a gorgeous woman, it's lust that drives my gaze. I dream of dragging her to bed and kissing her senseless. Or, at the very least, I think: "Um, yummy!". Just like when I look at men.

Re: Hi! Here via metafandom

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Exactly! Sexuality and sexual attraction are very distinct and identifiable feelings. Sex and admiration aren't the same, though they coincide frequently.

Re: Hi! Here via metafandom

[http://users.livejournal.com/tefnut_/]

Well said.

[executrix.livejournal.com]

It doesn't help when you have to spend the rest of the time in an environment where people think that their heterosexuality is some kind of personal achievement for which they deserve worship...but one thing you gotta say for fandom, there are a lot of bisexuals here.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Well, fandom, I think, attracts the people who are more willing to admit to less than popular passions in the first place. We're the sort of people who'll go ahead and say -- "Yeah, I can name every episode of Buffy and that doesn't make me pathetic." So, it's easier for us to take the step of saying that we can find both men and women attractive without letting stand the accusations of being a) a pervert, b) a liar, or c) a slut.

But yeah, all the people who complain about having 'gays' pushed on them... straight sex is everywhere. It's used to promote everything. People just don't notice because it's 'normal'.

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

Yea. What's most frustrating is that it's so transparently reactionary, rather than actually being about what they claim.

[kjsilopanna.livejournal.com]

I'm here via metafandom...*bows in solidarity with you* I'm bi as well, and I find myself surrounded by a bunch of people at my university who treat me almost as a pity case--like "oh, isn't it too bad that she's that way?", when I'm perfectly okay with the fact that I like girls. I'm guilty, however, of not standing up for myself a lot of the time--I'm from a very strict conservative Methodist family (though I am a liberal and a Buddhist) and I'm used to just not talking about anything relating to sexuality, hetero or otherwise. My silence turns into something of a crime of omission when people assume the wrong thing and let it perpetuate their own beliefs. I wish I knew other bi/lesbian girls at my university so I could have someone to help my friends understand. Sorry for the self-indulgent rant, but I needed to get it out and this seemed like an appropriate thread...

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Don't feel bad at all. My rant is your rant. Literally, even.

And it is frustrating. I'd like to find a group or something around where I am (which can't be so hard, since apparently Portland has largest concentration of lesbians in the US) but I just haven't found the time. I should be making the time for it.

But it is tough. Saying here on lj, where I know that people agree with me, is one thing. Anywhere else, it is a gamble to open your mouth and I'm only brave enough to take it some of the time.

Working on it, though.