Writing: Thoughts on Method

[butterfly]

I get the impression, from glancing around lj, that my particular writing method is not the most common (it may just not be the most commonly talked about, of course).

1. When I write, I start with one thing. This one thing is the center of the work, making it rather like an essay disguised as fiction. Now, usually, this has led to writing rather short emotional vignettes, but over the past couple of fandoms (starting with due South), this has begun to change. Some ideas are bigger than others, or at least, they take up more room. Also, I've really been working on the ability to extend an idea into a plot, which bodes well for my unfinished works in progress. Once I've finished White Rabbits, at least.

2. I am incapable of writing with music on in the background. I've seen many fics where authors say, "and I wrote this while listening to this song" and I go, "how?". If there's music on, I get distracted. If there's sound of any kind, I'm apt to get distracted. I need to be able to completely concentrate on the issue at hand.

3. The majority of the time, I do not use a beta reader. In fact, so far, the number of finished stories of mine that have been beta-read is... one. My huge SG-1 AU is being beta read, but since I've been stalled on the story since I picked up the Star Wars obsession, this is rather on hold. My reasoning is actually fairly simple -- I'm a vastly impatient person. Once I've written something, I want it to exist and to breathe on its own. This is something that I've been loath to say in public on lj, for fear of coming across as an Anne Rice, puffed up and arrogant, but yes, there it is.

Comments

[larakailyn.livejournal.com]

Ack. That reminds me - if you do pick up the Stargate story again - my e-mail address has changed. It's laranp @ darling-moon.com now. I don't think I ever told you!

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Thank you!

I'm glad that you're still willing to beta it. I still have no idea when I'll get back to it, though. This new story just continues to utterly eat my brain.

[larakailyn.livejournal.com]

Of course I am. :) Definitely now about other stories coming out of nowhere and eating the brain, though. I've had several fics do that to me.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

So, I appear to be writing my Stargate AU again. You still free to do beta work?

*smiles winningly*

[larakailyn.livejournal.com]

Yes, I am. :)

My addy is laranp@darling-moon.com now in case I haven't given it to you.

[larakailyn.livejournal.com]

Which obviously, I did - I couldn't see my old comment! D'oh!

re: story

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Oh, 'that Chicago school thing' is just a placeholder until doublecheck on where Daniel did his work with that Professor who died in The Curse (I suspect it is simple, like, the University of Chicago or something). But yes, I hadn't realized that that was unfixed until I'd already sent the drafts off to you.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I've sent off an email.

[citizenjess.livejournal.com]

My reasoning is actually fairly simple -- I'm a vastly impatient person. Once I've written something, I want it to exist and to breathe on its own. This is something that I've been loath to say in public on lj, for fear of coming across as an Anne Rice, puffed up and arrogant, but yes, there it is.

I'm the same way - I agree with whatever reasons people have for using beta readers, and have done so myself, but ... um, more often than not, when I feel something is ready to be posted, I don't want to wait. Instant gratification is one of the true perks of the Internet after all, you know?

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Instant gratification, yay!

Hee, yes, that's completely how I feel. I think the whole beta thing is very cool and highly respectable, but I don't like waiting to post a story that feels ready.

[citizenjess.livejournal.com]

It's like, I agree with the reasons for having a regular beta reader, and if I were a Better Person, I would actually use one. But uh, turns out I'm not! :D

[teaphile.livejournal.com]

I can't write with music on either. I'm so word-focused that I get distracted from what I'm writing by the lyrics. If it's instrumental, I find the mood of the music doesn't change as quickly as the mood of the story, and I get all mixed up.

I also only use a beta reader when I have a problem that I can't solve on my own. I think I've only had two stories officially betaed, and a few others that people have given small comments on while I've been working on them, if I've posted parts to my lj.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I can't write with music on either. I'm so word-focused that I get distracted from what I'm writing by the lyrics. If it's instrumental, I find the mood of the music doesn't change as quickly as the mood of the story, and I get all mixed up.

Yes, that's exactly how I feel.

I also only use a beta reader when I have a problem that I can't solve on my own. I think I've only had two stories officially betaed, and a few others that people have given small comments on while I've been working on them, if I've posted parts to my lj.

That last part is something that I really enjoy.

And I love the interactive vibe of posting online, period. I really do think of fanfic in the vein of folk stories, back in the day, endless variations on the tale of the day.

[teaphile.livejournal.com]

I adore creating with a group, epecially the brainstorming part. One of the most fun times I've ever had writing was when a group of us (between five and twelve depending on the day of the week) wrote a musical comedy for the theatre group we were in. I love how ideas feed off each other, how different personalities and interests come together to make something wholly new that I would never have come up with on my own.

[applewoman.livejournal.com]

1 and 2 sound a lot like me, especially #2, the music thing. I can only listen to music when I'm doing something with my hands that doesn't involve the word-related parts of my brain -- like cleaning a room or typesetting a manuscript. Anything I'm doing with words has a tune of its own that I need to hear, and music gets in the way.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Anything I'm doing with words has a tune of its own that I need to hear, and music gets in the way.

That is a beautiful way of putting it. Yes.

[ilanabean42.livejournal.com]

I can sometimes write with music in the background, but only if I can mostly tune it out, which is why if anything I usually listen to music without lyrics. I also tend to have to stop the music periodically if I'm having a hard time making something sound right or figuring out where I'm going. This is why I usually just write without music, as it's easier without distraction.

As for beta reading, I tend to not get much beyond a quick spelling/grammar check by a friend to turn up any stupid things I missed in my own editing. I don't know that beta reading is really necessary unless you either have serious language problems or are writing something that might not make sense to someone who doesn't know all the background you have in your head (since that's not something you can check for yourself). It doesn't hurt, but I've found that when I do send things to people for beta, they never have much to say, so it doesn't seem worth the effort.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

As for beta reading, I tend to not get much beyond a quick spelling/grammar check by a friend to turn up any stupid things I missed in my own editing. I don't know that beta reading is really necessary unless you either have serious language problems or are writing something that might not make sense to someone who doesn't know all the background you have in your head (since that's not something you can check for yourself). It doesn't hurt, but I've found that when I do send things to people for beta, they never have much to say, so it doesn't seem worth the effort.

This is exactly why I'm bouncing my SG AU off of a beta. The way that I'm writing the story involved two entirely different stories that intersect and I want to make sure that I pull of the emotion without giving away too much all at once, while still having it be understandable. I need to walk the line between giving too little away and too much.

[ingrid-m.livejournal.com]

My reasoning is actually fairly simple -- I'm a vastly impatient person.

*nods and raises hand* Me too. Beta readers, lord love them, have lives that interfere with my own "OMGRIGHTNOW!" fic-posting schedule.

Once I've written something, I want it to exist and to breathe on its own. This is something that I've been loath to say in public on lj, for fear of coming across as an Anne Rice, puffed up and arrogant, but yes, there it is.

It's only arrogant if you think it's *perfect* as it (as Miss Rice certainly does). I'm pretty sure that you believe, as I do, a few mistakes might have been caught by a read-over from different eyes, but the main gist is what you wished it would be. Right? *g*

[ingrid-m.livejournal.com]

PS: I need silence while writing too. No TV, no music ... too distracting.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

*nods and raises hand* Me too. Beta readers, lord love them, have lives that interfere with my own "OMGRIGHTNOW!" fic-posting schedule.

Yes, exactly.

It's only arrogant if you think it's *perfect* as it (as Miss Rice certainly does). I'm pretty sure that you believe, as I do, a few mistakes might have been caught by a read-over from different eyes, but the main gist is what you wished it would be. Right? *g*

Sure, uh-huh.

*innocent smile*

But seriously, yeah, that's about the size of it.

[emrinalexander.livejournal.com]

I can't write with music on - I end up listening to music, not writing. I do like to write with innocuous tv on in the background, though - I find the History Channel to be particularly soothing *G*.

[teaphile.livejournal.com]

Hee. Despite the fact that I am terminally distracted by voices, I'm writing a rather long story right now that flows much more easily with HGTV on in the background. But it's only the one story. I think it might have something to do with the extremely non-challenging language of the programs and the fact that my story is mostly made up of letters by kids.

[serenenuit.livejournal.com]

When you say you start with one thing, what do you mean? You start with one relationship or a certain theme and follow it from there? I like to hear the impetus for why others write.

I cannot write with music on in the background either as it will oftentimes lead me to thinking about other things I want to write or do and I get sidetracked from the piece I'm trying to finish. I can leave the TV on but it's muted so that I cannot hear it. So what's the point of leaving it on? It's too still if it's not on. Make sense? Probably not.

And although I don't post my work anywhere, I have a beta reader. My problem is that I know all of the backstory and my characters move and speak in a certain manner because, well, it's their story and they know it. Having someone else read it helps me make sure they move from place to place in a manner that flows and/or that the dialogue isn't stilted or awkward. And as my beta can testify, she may make a suggestion but I'll shoot it down because I don't think it fits with what I have in mind. I'll debate anything but if you bring something to my attention and say it needs to be changed then you better have some pretty strong arguments.

I've beta-ed for others also and the hardest part for me, in the early stages, was not to impose my writing style on their fics. I've gotten over that though, thank goodness.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

When you say you start with one thing, what do you mean? You start with one relationship or a certain theme and follow it from there? I like to hear the impetus for why others write.

I tend to write stories straight through -- I start with one line, and the story builds from there. Many times, I've started writing and not realized what I was writing about until a bit into the story.

I start writing, build from up from the first line, and then wind back down. It's an intensely unplanned process. Even the WiP that I'm doing right now is like that -- I know how it ends, but I don't have anything resembling an outline for it. I start with the first thing in the story and then find out what the second thing is as I write.

It's really hard to describe how I write, actually. I start, I go until I stop, and then I edit. I basically subsume who I am under who I believe the character to be -- try to notice what they would notice, feel what they feel. Soncentrating on experiencing the world the way the character does (one day, I will attempt to write something that isn't heavily pov-based, so that I can learn how, but first I must finish learning plot).

[serenenuit.livejournal.com]

I understand what you mean. I've done that myself before too. I know people that work with outlines and plot out what will happen and have a set plan. I just write and see where it goes.

A friend gave me a challenge once for a drabble and eight pages later, I realized I had her fic plus another one that sprang out of what I was doing for her. Funny how the muse works sometimes.

Thanks for answering my question.

[katie-m.livejournal.com]

You'd only sound puffed up and arrogant if you said nothing of yours could ever be improved by a beta, because your sacred words are inviolable. Or something like that.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Hee. Noted!

[soralin.livejournal.com]

Your writing is freakishly good for something unbeta'd.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Thank you! My mom always did say that I should be a copy editor.

[rabidfangurl.livejournal.com]

Never fear about the lack of beta'ing. Firstly, your stuff seems fine without, and you take concrit well, which is like a beta, only from more people. Secondly, half my stuff goes forth without a beta, for I, too, like instant gratification, and anything I write straight to LJ I'm not going to stop an e-mail off to someone.

As for the music thing, I tend to write with music playing without a problem, but I grew up with two noisy sisters. If I wanted to read, I had to learn how to tune out background noise, so at this point, having music on is merely having *melodic* background noise, easily tuned out if need be. It's a matter of personal taste, I think, and whether one learned the ability to ignore distractions of that sort.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Never fear about the lack of beta'ing. Firstly, your stuff seems fine without, and you take concrit well, which is like a beta, only from more people. Secondly, half my stuff goes forth without a beta, for I, too, like instant gratification, and anything I write straight to LJ I'm not going to stop an e-mail off to someone.

Which reminds me -- SW on lj is a delightfully concrit-filled fandom. Y'all are absolutely delightful and I'm just constantly thrilled to be in the fandom (note: I'm possibly still on that new fandom high).

As for the music thing, I tend to write with music playing without a problem, but I grew up with two noisy sisters. If I wanted to read, I had to learn how to tune out background noise, so at this point, having music on is merely having *melodic* background noise, easily tuned out if need be. It's a matter of personal taste, I think, and whether one learned the ability to ignore distractions of that sort.

Ah, yes, I grew up with a lot more silence. My brother isn't the noisy sort and we were latch-key kids for quite a while, so no parental noise, either.

[londonkds.livejournal.com]

Hm.. I can't write "to" music, but I do find myself getting inspired to write stuff by music to the point of starting to write as soon as the song ends.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

That's a very interesting and important distinction.

[pershin.livejournal.com]

Well.. you don't really have to worry if your writing method is a bit/quite different from another, you writers all have different styles and that results to different outcomes. After all, if all writers have the same method of getting inspiration, writing etc, the literary would be a terribly boring place.

About the beta, I didn't actually see anything that would distract me from reading the story, no grammar error, break in the story etc. I could only vouch for White Rabbits and that story was formed wonderfully well to zone me out for a couple of minutes.

Sorry if this confuses you XDXDXD

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Not confusing at all. And thank you.

part one of two

[a-blue-moon-cat.livejournal.com]

Your ideas don't sound unusual to me, at all.

1. I think that I start with one idea in mind, also. Was trained in high school by a great English teacher, so that non-fiction writing skill to express that one idea has mostly stayed with me. (One of the lovely things about the Net is that we get to use these essay writing skills a lot. *smiles*) But sometimes the one idea can build and grow and expand and just take off for parts unknown, leaving the author shaking her head in wonder.

However, I write mostly poetry and only recently drabbles, so one idea is critical to those styles or genres or whatever they wish to be named.

2. I don't usually write poems or drabbles with any kind of music. I prefer to concentrate on what I'm writing. Lyrics would totally distract me. Classical or soundtrack music at a soft volume is okay at times whilst writing non fiction like this. As for the Music bit, if I have one posted, with a poem or a drabble, it's because I edited the writing for a while, and only later posted whilst some music might be on. Most of the time around here the 'music' is my cats purring. :)

3. Beta readers can be quite useful, in a copy-editor way, I think. I usually copy-edit my own writing, however, esp. my poems. I might change something in a fiction at someone else's suggestion, but probably not in the poetry. :) More than anything else, poetry comes from the heart via the mind, and those emotions need to be *there* and not be edited away by some one else, who might not be feeling what I felt when I wrote the poem. Besides all that, ideas generally hit me like a brick wall, and I have to slam them down on paper or via the keyboard as quickly as possible. :) Then, after that first rush of creatively, I edit, tinker, re-write, until I have a version that I like, that still expresses what I wanted it to say. I usually keep the different versions of my poems, but not the drabbles, strangely enough. :) However, if I got around to writing some sort of epic-length fic, I might would ask someone that I respected and who would respect my work to beta. In other words, someone who could catch the mechanical errors that I might miss, who would offer good concrit, but would not substantially try and change the story too much.

But style is such a personal thing, and often a matter of taste. There's only so much that I would suggest as a beta-reader, and in turn, only so much that I would accept changes to in my style.

part two of two

[a-blue-moon-cat.livejournal.com]

As for the Anne Rice thing, well, to be honest, I haven't read any of her more current writings. It's seemingly true that if one becomes a best-selling author, their publishing house seems loath to do even the most basic of copy-editing. :( There's a number of SF novels I've read over the years that could have stood a little basic editing in matters of grammar and the like, not to mention basic theories in physics. *sad smile*

I've heard that Stephen King doesn't get edited anymore, either. Not the biggest fan of his novels, but his earlier short stories are well-crafted gems of the horror genre. As I have found with writing drabbles, interestingly enough, being forced to write at a shorter length isn't always restricted. One has to make some clear-cut decisions about the basics, things like word choice, sentence structure, visuals, etc., that one would not have to make in a longer story. However, I like the ability to just write forever as far as something epic-length goes.

Here's where it gets interesting. :) I've read a number of novellas that later got expanded into novels. Usually the novels weren't as good, IMHO. For example, Roger Zelazny did this, and his fans mostly concur that the novellas were better stories and better written. Sometimes less *is* more. If it starts out as an epic, no problem. *grins* I'm happy to read. But if it was a short story, sometimes it doesn't work at novel length. It didn't need expanding after all. However, I'm in the middle of a sequel to a drabble, so perhaps sometimes things do need expanding. It all depends.

Maxwell Perkins, the great editor at Scribners in the early part of the 20th century, back when editors could actually edit, and not have to rush around all the time just to *sell* the author, would send Thomas Wolfe home with orders to cut 50,000 words. Wolfe would do so, but then write 100,000 more. *smiles*

I've also read the expanded editions of Robert Heinlein, probably the greatest American SF writer ever, IMHO, but found those too long and way too preachy. Seems his editor cut enough to make him a better writer. *smiles* I prefer the original published editions.

But it all depends on the individual. If you don't feel you need a beta, then you probably don't. I tried a workshop approach once, and it wasn't in the end the best thing for me. A friend bugged me for years about writing something together. He finally wrote it with another friend, and I happily copy-edited for them.

In the end, writing is a highly personal thing. I feel that writers should just write to please themselves. If anyone else gets to read it and likes it, that's just frosting on the cake. *smiles*

As always, all this is just my humble opinion and your mileage may vary.