Doctor Who 1x02 - "The End of the World"
Aug. 2nd, 2008 10:19 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
butterfly
written by Russell T Davies
directed by Euros Lyn
General Thoughts
At the close of "The End of the World" is where I believe what Rose means changes for the Doctor. In this episode, he displays roughly the same attitude toward her being placed in danger that he does every other companion that he has ever had. After this episode, it's a different story.
Bechdel Test
Rose talks to Jackie, Cassandra, and Raffalo in this episode.
Her conversation with Jackie is entirely about her checking in on her mother, testing out her phone, and her mom thinking that she's being a little daft. It's a really adorable conversation that is easy for us to see takes place during that very first day from "Rose" because of both the conversational note of "lottery money" and Jackie wearing the clothes that she's wearing later when Rose gets home after Henriks blows up.
Her conversation with Raffalo does end up bringing the Doctor into it, but before that, we have a nice talk between the two of them where we get to see Rose reaching out to someone even while she's in the process of freaking out herself. She's interested and curious and considerate.
The Cassandra conversation is entirely about setting up their own antagonism toward each other -- it's personal and the Doctor doesn't even figure into it.
"The End of the World" passes the Bechdel test.
Themes and Arcs
The Doctor as Myth (aka 'The Lonely God')
The Doctor decides that Cassandra has lived long enough and that it's time for her to die. We also get Jabe telling the Doctor that it's a wonder that he 'even exists'. He displays impressive powers and we find out that his people were 'Time Lords'. Both Jabe and Rose, though, express sympathy for him as a person and not just a symbol.
Words and Phases of Note
This episode marks the first appearance of the phrase 'Bad Wolf', as well as the first time we meet the Face of Boe and Cassandra.
Reoccurring Characters
Rose Tyler
This is our first real look at the 'jeopardy-friendly' Rose. She saved the Doctor in the last episode and he gets to save her here.
When the Doctor offers Rose the choice of going backwards or forwards in time, she chooses forwards (this is something that the Doctor should have remembered before throwing around certain accusations in a future episode). That's what Rose wants -- to expand her boundaries and to seek out new horizons. Her choice is a hundred years in the future, which the Doctor declares a bit boring and she is more than willing to go further.
Once they get to the future (the year 5.5/Apple/26 -- roughly five billion years into Rose's future, though I doubt exactly, as he was aiming for a particular event and not a particular year), Rose continues to show her persistent and curious nature by having a stream of questions for the Doctor. What she learns from the Doctor (that this rich group of aliens is gathering to watch her planet burn, just for fun) is a perspective check. Here she starts to see that there are more distant and alien ways to view the Earth. There are people who don't automatically think of it as 'home' and she's traveling with one of them.
Something else that we learn here is that when Rose hears something, she remembers it -- she points out to the Doctor that the sun expanding is supposed to take years and that the continents should have shifted. The Doctor tells her that the planet is going to burn and all of the people are gone and Rose gets to experience what it's like to be the Doctor. She's suddenly the last human (until Cassandra shows up... and then until Rose finds out that humans aren't as gone as she thought).
They meet the Steward and we get the alien introduction sequence, where Rose starts out mildly weirded out and just gets more and more freaked as time passes. These aliens look alien in a way that the Doctor doesn't and seeing them has got to have started her thinking about all the ways in which he might not be like her. Rose is eventually overcome by everything and has to leave the room.
We see her staring out a window at the glowing proof that she's billions of years away from her home and that she has absolutely no control over her life. Luckily, she meets Raffalo, who gives Rose a chance to realize that, even though some of these people are blue, they're still 'people'. She can experience first-hand that 'people' means more than just 'humans'. This is also the first time that we see Rose get thrown by the restrictions that some futures have placed on their working class population -- Raffalo isn't allowed to speak to the guests without permission. The future may have shiny space stations but it is no Utopia. There's still a confining class system in place and Rose can identify with that.
"They still have plumbers," she says and that's something she can work off of. But then Raffalo asks Rose where she comes from and she realizes that she really doesn't know who this Doctor person is. If he wanted to, he could abandon her here and she would be able to do nothing about it and she barely knows him. Enough to know that he's dangerous and alluring and fascinating and that he needs help sometimes but that's about it.
Rose leaves Raffalo and ends up on an observation deck -- possibly the same one that the TARDIS has just been removed from, considering how easily the Doctor finds her. The announcement reminds her that the Earth is going to burn in twenty-five minutes, which does nothing to improve her mood. She tries to distract herself by introducing herself to the cutting of Jabe's grandfather, only to quit in disgust. "I'm talking to a twig." She's moody and uncertain about her impulsive choice to run into the TARDIS with the Doctor (this will not be the last time we see Rose doubt her impulses when it comes to accepting the Doctor and his life, but as shown here, she also has a habit of working through those doubts and accepting with her mind as well as her instincts).
Her conversation with the Doctor helps a bit, but she's still left a bit unsettled by it all when she goes off to talk to Cassandra. She and Cassandra pretty much immediately start to get on each other's nerves. Cassandra is waxing nostalgic about Earth and Rose is trying to get some actual information out of her (she never stops wanting to learn and wanting to do and be more). She ends up finding out that Cassandra is just another bigot and far from 'the last human'. There are all kinds of humans out there in the universe, they just aren't pure enough for Cassandra's tastes.
We get some additional insight into Rose here as well. She had a slight zing towards plastic surgery in "Rose" (she suggests "the breast implants," when the Doctor is talking about plastic coming alive) but here she really attacks Cassandra as not even being human anymore because of all of her 'improvements'.
And this one line in particular, "it's better to die than live like you: a bitchy trampoline," gave me something to think about regarding future events and why Rose might not consider immortality worth the potential drawbacks. Cassandra unnaturally stretched out her life and let the desperate desire not to die turn her into a monster. Rose wouldn't want that to happen to herself.
So, Rose goes off, still miffed and gets conked over the head. And I love this moment because it's personal. This happens because she pissed Cassandra off. It has nothing to do with the Doctor and it doesn't happen just because she's there. It happens because she's Rose. Rose is, quite possibly, the most active character in the series -- she's definitely more active than the Doctor, who generally goes places and then reacts to whatever events are occurring. Rose will go and make things happen. This is also generally true in her relationship with the Doctor -- she's the aggressive actor and he's the more passive reactor. It's a really good way of equalizing a potentially large power gap between the two of them.
But here and now, Rose is facing her own possible death, just seconds and inches away.
And the Doctor does stop it. He saves her.
Rose goes back to the main deck and sees the assorted dead and they're just people. Just like her, they're people, no matter what they look like. She understands that now. Even Cassandra, who tried to kill people and who Rose greatly dislikes, is someone for whom Rose can feel compassion.
The Doctor
We really start to explore the Doctor in this episode. We get to see what the Doctor is like when he isn't interacting with Rose. First, though, he wants to impress Rose. He's constantly looking at her in this episode to assess her reaction.
The Doctor is very gleeful about the Earth burning in this episode. I suspect that he's using this trip as a way to work out some of the issues that he carries about being able to save the Earth so many times while his own people had to die. This time, he's not going to save the Earth. He's going to watch it burn to pieces and he's going to enjoy it.
When the Steward comes in, we get our first good look at the Doctor's standard infiltration trick: wave around the psychic paper and pretend that you belong. It's amazing that it takes as long as it does for that habit to catch up with him -- it's his supreme self-confidence that pulls it off, more than the paper.
The Doctor and Jabe are very flirty with each other right from the start. She's surprised and pleased by the 'intimacy' of his gift and his return flirtation feels far more genuine that we ever really seen him do with anyone other than Rose. And Jabe is fascinated enough by him from that first meeting to scan him so that she can find out what species he is.
He, however, is more concerned with Rose at this point in time and he leaves the main room to follow her.
After his less than fully satisfying discussion with Rose, though, he's quick to turn his attentions around to Jabe and to let Rose go off to talk to Cassandra. His relationship with Jabe is very intriguing and comes at a very good point for the show. Jabe is very helpful and very interested in the Doctor, but she doesn't get that buzz out of danger that we've already seen that both the Doctor and Rose get. We also get another hint into the Doctor's personality in his first solo conversation with Jabe -- we learn that he rather likes not having anyone to turn to when things get rough and that he enjoys running headlong into trouble.
The Doctor tries to feel out Jabe's motives and he doubts their purity. Because of her wealth, he scoffs when she says that she came to the event out of respect for the Earth. In the end, though, it appears respect really is her sincere answer. Her people were once the tropical rainforests and she wants to be there to help witness the passing of her world of origin. Jabe genuinely cares. We also get to see her express direct sympathy to the Doctor. She found out his species and offers him a comforting touch. She's a good person. And the Doctor responds to that by letting her just a little bit into the depth of his grief before he quickly moves both of them on to less emotional pastures.
"Perhaps a man only enjoys trouble when there's nothing left," Jabe speculates. It's an interesting theory. Rose doesn't feel like she has anything that's worth having. Is that connected to how much she loves traveling with the Doctor?
The Doctor and Jabe work on the mystery and continue to flirt with each other, and the role of 'companion' is pretty much played by Jabe for the rest of the episode. We get to see the cleverness of the Doctor in figuring out that the Adherents of the Repeated Meme are just a cover for the real villain and we get another look at his feelings about money and the people who chase after it.
"Five billion years and it still all comes down to money," he says, with disgust dripping from his voice. The Doctor does not admire people who grasp for more money and a higher station. He tends to admire the outcasts, the exiles, and the forgotten ones.
We then get to see the Doctor manufacture a solution for the crisis on the fly... and Jabe puts her life at risk so that he can reach the other side of the platform. And she knows what his species is and understand something of what he's gone through and that can pull a smile out of him and give him the strength to cross the bridge.
Jabe burned to give him a chance and we see the Doctor summon up something from inside himself that lets him get past the quickly-rotating fan blades of death and get to the switch in time. We see this time and again -- when other people believe in him, he can accomplish so much more.
People like Jabe give him hope. People like Cassandra disgust him. He's pleased to let her explode and not even Rose's soft plea that he help her makes a difference.
"Everything has its time and everything dies." This is a major theme of the show and of the Doctor's character. Everything dies. It's something that he struggles with over the series and something that must feel so much more real to him because of the loss of his own people.
The Face of Boe
We don't really get much out of him -- he's the one that's being talked to about the 'Bad Wolf' scenario. He's the one who sponsored the event, which is interesting to think about. Did the Doctor and Rose ever share stories about what happened on their very first trip? We know that they do rehash older adventures while in the presence of people who weren't there.
Lady Cassandra Dot Delta O'Brien
Oh, Cassandra. Here, she's a shallow, vain murderer. And we can't forget that she's a bigot! But she is clever. If the Doctor hadn't come onto the platform, she might very well have gotten away with it all.
Continuing Relationships
Doctor/Rose
It starts with a challenge. The Doctor is challenging Rose to pick something and he's aiming to impress her. He's got her on his ship and he wants her to be happy enough to stay there, so he offers her the choice. When Rose picks a mere hundred years forward, he challenges her to try for further. When she isn't impressed with his declaration that he's taken her a thousand years into the future, he gets visibly miffed. He goes for the big guns. She refuses to be impressed by him... well, he'll pick something that'll knock her socks off.
And what he does here is cruel, though it makes a lot of sense with where the Doctor is emotionally (and the Doctor is very often not a nice man). He wants Rose to be impressed with what he can do, he wants her to understand him, and he's in so much pain over losing his people. It makes complete sense that he takes this girl here. Because again, he's asking that question -- will this be what scares you off? Every single time he asks, she says eventually says no.
The way that the Doctor folds Rose into his introduction to the Steward is particularly adorable -- and his explanation of the psychic paper is very low-key. It's very casual, like he knows that this is something that Rose will need to know for the future. When he doesn't think about it, he tends to act as though he believes that she'll choose to stay. It's only when his oversized brain gets in his way that he has stupid doubts.
During the scene where the aliens enter, the Doctor starts out being utterly thrilled, both by the aliens themselves and by Rose's reaction. But as she becomes less 'impressed' and more 'upset', he starts to look more and more concerned. He's just about the only person who appears to be genuinely amused by Cassandra, but he's also becoming very unhappy about the way Rose is reacting.
When he sees her leave the room, he loses his smile over the music and heads out after her. When he catches up with her, he willingly starts a conversation about Rose's emotional state -- we know that he followed her because she looked upset and here he is, asking her what she thinks of everything. Rose manages to be light-hearted about it for a moment and then gets to what's been bothering her -- these aliens are very visibly alien. This leads into her asking the Doctor where he's from and what his planet of origin is. Because she looks at him and he doesn't look alien but she knows that he is. The Doctor dodges the question, but then Rose brings up another issue.
Why are all the aliens speaking English? Here, we get to a big issue between the Doctor and Rose (and, really, the Doctor and everyone else in the universe).
"You didn't even ask."
"I didn't think about it like that."
He proudly tells her that the TARDIS translates alien languages inside her head and Rose takes offense. For her, it's only natural to be shocked and suspicious that the Doctor has let something inside her head without her permission, while the Doctor doesn't see what the problem is if it doesn't hurt her. Compared to some of the later choices that the Doctor makes without people's permission, this seems like a minor issue, but it sets up the pattern. And he is completely thrown by her reaction. To him, his ship is this marvelous and wonderful thing and Rose doesn't like it. She still isn't impressed.
Here, too, Rose dings him for being jokey in a serious situation ("Too busy thinking up cheap shots about the Deep South.") because she doesn't understand his life. Once she does, she's actually going to find her herself doing both of the things that she gets mad at the Doctor about here -- she makes a huge, life-changing decision for someone without his permission and she ends up frequently enjoying using humor in dark moments as well.
After Rose and the Doctor argue, the Doctor stalks off down the stairs to sulk. It's notable that he doesn't go very far at all.
Rose is the one to make the first move toward reconciliation -- and the Doctor's irritation can't hold against even one sentence from her. Rose points out how dependent she is on him for everything in this place, but in a more light-hearted way than she had before. And the Doctor responds to that by giving her a way to call home. They end their fight with mutual teasing rather than any big apologetic scenes. They press right up against each other briefly during their conversation, each willing to let the other person into their personal space.
Supercharging her phone is something that does impress Rose. The Doctor sees the awe of her face as her call connects and he breaks out in a very pleased smile. He continues to glance at her throughout the conversation, so thrilled that he's finally managed to impress her. When Rose says, "Mum," you can see him take in the knowledge that her mother is the person that she chooses to call, so he places Jackie at the top of the list of people that Rose cares about (where she will remain in the eyes of the Doctor, even after Rose has begun to try to let him know that he's taken the top position). I suspect that he's also a bit glad that she doesn't call Mickey. So, Rose is happy because she gets to talk to her mom and the Doctor is happy because Rose is happy. And then Rose gets off the phone and notes that, in this time period, her mother is dead.
That Rose Tyler simply refuses to stay impressed. The Doctor is instantly brought down by her mood shift and is intrigued and relieved when he gets handed an emergency.
They go back to the main room and the Doctor invites Jabe into their conversation. This will not be the last time that he rushes to distract himself and Rose with a third party after things have gotten too emotional for him. Jabe tries to feel out what the relationship between the Doctor and Rose is and the Doctor shoots down 'wife', 'partner', and 'concubine'. When she gets to 'prostitute', Rose has had enough. She's looked increasingly annoyed throughout Jabe's questioning and at this she gets openly offended and leaves to go talk to Cassandra. The Doctor warns Rose not to start a fight and she, in turn, jokingly sets a curfew on him (while knowing all too well that she has no way of actually controlling his behavior). Rose clearly isn't sure what to think -- the Doctor seems to have hit things off with Jabe as easily as he did with Rose. Is their friendship anything special or is that what he always does with the local girls?
After she's been taken out by Cassandra, the Doctor comes by to stop the sun filter from descending. "Oh, well, it would be you," the Doctor says when he hears her voice. He's already beginning to see that Rose practically invites danger in for tea. Here, he's mostly irritated by it, but we can see by his smile after he gets the sun filter to start up the first time just how relieved he is to be saving her and how worried he was. Then it starts descending again and Rose accuses him of "mucking about" and she's annoyed about him for not being fast enough. When he does finally get the sun filter to stay up, they're both frustrated as hell -- the Doctor tells Rose to stay put and her reply is snappy. And we do see, later, that she leaves that room as soon as she can, before the Doctor comes back.
Rose does not tend to stay where the Doctor puts her. She's contrary and independent like that.
When the Doctor returns to the main room after losing Jabe, he and Rose share a glance before he goes over to tell Jabe's people what happened. Rose would have noticed that Jabe wasn't with him and, seeing the death all around her and knowing how close she herself came, she must be able to guess what happened. And her first words to him are that question -- "are you all right?"
She sees how dangerous his life is but she also can see the toll that it takes on him and how hard he tries to deny it. The Doctor is quite bitter and angry throughout the next sequence, which is a bit of foreshadowing for his reaction to a similar, deeper loss in the future. And Rose sees how cold he is when he deals with Cassandra.
The next time we see Rose, she's watching bits of the Earth wheel by outside the window. The Doctor is watching her and then he goes over to her -- they've both experienced so much over this past half hour. Rose is sad and overwhelmed by the passing of the Earth, mentioning in particular how no one watched it go, and the Doctor reaches out to take her hand and lead her somewhere where he can try to help her heal all the ways that he's hurt her by taking her here.
He takes her to a living, busy Earth, full of people and noise. He takes her there and gives away another little piece of himself, without her needing to ask him to start. He tells her that what she just went through is something that he understands, because his people and his planet are just as gone as the Earth was to her a few minutes ago.
"I'm left traveling on my own because there's no one else," he tells her and she responds so simply and with such kindness -- "There's me." She offers him her company and he reminds her that she knows just how dangerous it is now -- does she really want to make this choice?
She tells him that she doesn't know and we can see the uncertainty in his eyes and just how much is riding on her choice. Then... she smells chips and breaks the tension and makes him smile again. She tells him 'yes' without needing to say the actual word ("before you get me back in that box..."). In retrospect, this conversation is where I think that the Doctor starts to fall in love with Rose and where he had no chance left to pull back. He lights up at her words and looks at her like she's just hung the sun in the sky.
And from this point forward, he begins to treat her differently than we ever have (or will in the known future) see him treat other companions. Arguably, this is the moment when Rose stops being a companion and starts being his partner. Because she saw him in all his danger and all his pain and she decided to stay with him as if it were the most natural choice in the universe. The Doctor and Rose. In the TARDIS.
As it should be.
Rose/Jackie
Rose calls home. Their conversation here is really adorable. Rose is overwhelmed by when she is and Jackie's words are so ordinary and normal that they remind Rose of the world that she's left behind. It gives Rose a bit of a handle, for a moment, something to hold onto. And Rose tries to give her mother a bit of reassurance here, by saying that she'll be home late... unfortunately, this is the night that Henriks blows up, so Jackie's last memory of Rose is still that last bit of laughter after the Auton attack. But it's sweet that Rose doesn't want her mother to worry.
General Squee
Billie Piper
She continues to be so amazing. She captures all of these incredible moments and just effortlessly brings us into this world of aliens and we get to learn it right along with her.
Christopher Eccleston
This is the episode where I originally fell in love with the Doctor. It was that last scene that did it -- him going to Rose and taking her hand and showing her that her world isn't gone forever, just for the year five billion. He does an amazing job here, as always.
Special Effects
The CG in this episode is fantastic. It's so beautiful. All the aliens (Cassandra!) and the Earth and the sun and the expanding... it's all so beautifully done.
The Score
The hilarious perfection of "Tainted Love" and "Toxic" must be mentioned. They're so incredibly right for the moments that they appear in and, if it were me, I would never have thought of putting them in. Let us all praise the great mind(s) behind those song choices.
All the Rest
Jabe is another amazing guest character. We actually get to see, with Jabe, how ready the Doctor is for a deeper emotional investment -- his flirting with Jabe is much more intentional that we see later with other characters who find him attractive or than we saw back with previous Doctors (the Eighth Doctor's kisses with Grace were very sweet and emotionally open, but even there, we had less open flirting). Raffalo, the Steward, and Cassandra are also very memorable characters who felt real.
Some interesting notes: platform one forbids the use of weapons, teleportation, and religion. It's funny, but it's also very informative of the culture of that time period. Religion is publicly (and legally) considered very dangerous and/or powerful. Which it is, I don't disagree about that. But it's very interesting.
There are some really lovely shots and angles in this episode that show off the immensity of the space and how small the Doctor and Rose are within it.
I wonder what it is about 'our' Earth continents that are classic? Perhaps it's because that's how the Earth looked when it first really started making contact back with the stars and various alien lifeforms.
If "The End of the World" mostly showed us a hint of a more traditional Doctor/Companion relationship, "The Unquiet Dead" is where we get to see how the Doctor and Rose are going to break that mold and become something new.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-03 11:20 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-03 11:24 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-04 03:11 am (UTC)I really liked Jabe too and the interactions with the Doctor. Love seeing Rose develop and the Doctor too. I haven't seen much of Classic Who, so it's interesting to hear how his interactions with Rose are different. =)
Religion is publicly (and legally) considered very dangerous and/or powerful. Which it is, I don't disagree about that. But it's very interesting.
I think this is more an agenda of the showrunners than anything else. It's an ongoing theme here and especially in Torchwood.
The show pushes the idea that there we are our own authority by taking a stand for ourselves (the Doctor pushes this quite often) rather than relying on the authority of God or something like God.
It also mocks the idea of knowing/believing in personal deities in a universe as large as ours, as well as the idea that we could possibly know the whole universe from our tiny perspective (my mind goes to the Doctor responding to the Professor's insistence on no life being possible on the planet in the episode Midnight).
And in Torchwood especially, it emphasizes that when we die, that's it, there's nothing. We don't know what awaits us, if there's anything, so we'd better make it worthwhile.
So to me that line is well in lieu of all the other commentary about religion that the show has made.
(deleted & edited)
*uses First Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-04 03:54 pm (UTC)I adore this show so much. Just reviewing these two episodes has reminded me yet again of how much I adore these two characters and that amazing little blue box (as David Tennant says, it's the best ship ever invented).
I really liked Jabe too and the interactions with the Doctor.
The actress playing Jabe was really fantastic and she had great chemistry with the Doctor (and she appears, sans makeup, in a Torchwood role later on).
Love seeing Rose develop and the Doctor too.
They really do grow so much. And while the Doctor has been somewhat reset because of what happened in JE, he would not have ended up with the Martha-Jack support network without Rose and the journey of the last four years. He's renewed ties with Earth organizations through them and he's a deeper, more emotionally true and consistent character because of it.
And Rose grows so much. Seeing her in these two episodes, so overwhelmed and yet so bursting full of potential - she really does live up to every bit of it. Some people think that Rose stopped growing or went backwards in S2 and that does baffle me, I must admit. She becomes such a leader and stand-alone hero in S2.
I haven't seen much of Classic Who, so it's interesting to hear how his interactions with Rose are different.
Keeping in mind that this is all personal opinion: they always stayed away from being blatantly romantic (there's a serial in the First Doctor era where he nearly gets married to an Aztec princess and that's about it for some time) in the series proper. The Fourth Doctor and Romana had an interesting and close relationship but despite the fact that the actors married off-screen, their relationship strikes me as far more like the Doctor and Donna's when I actually watch it -- very close, but non-romantic.
Subtextually speaking, the Second Doctor and Jamie were very close (that's the person whose name the Doctor used in "Tooth and Claw"), but Jamie's memories were wiped of all but his first meeting with the Doctor by the Time Lords. The Third Doctor had something of a mildly flirtatious relationship with his companion Jo, who ending up leaving to marry someone she explicitly defines as like the Doctor, but younger (Jo reminds me a bit of Rose -- she also gets to grow quite a bit over her time with the Doctor) -- but that was very much subtext and definitely blurred by a paternal edge to their relationship.
Sarah Jane and the Doctor (Three and Four) are textually 'best friends' and their relationship (particularly Sarah and Four) reminds me very strongly of his relationship with Martha, though without the 'unrequited love' vibe. The show actively worked to blunt any possible subtext between the Fifth Doctor and his companions (Tegan was a little bit in love with him, though).
I can't recall any subtext with Six or Seven and their companions -- very friendship-based with a bit of paternalism, particularly with Seven and Ace (who was a bit like a younger and slightly more violent Rose -- I bet Rose would get a kick out of Nitro Nine!).
Grace is the first time that the Doctor got to be explicitly romantic with a 'companion' -- they kiss a couple of times in the movie and it's very cute. Their relationship is the best part of the movie (the movie is... not very good). But even there -- the Eighth Doctor clearly likes and is attracted to Grace, but it doesn't break his heart when she turns down his offer to travel with him. It's nothing like what develops between him and Rose.
Re: *uses First Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-05 04:24 pm (UTC)I see the differences between S1 & S2 and I think a lot of that had to do with the introduction of Tennant's Doctor. The dynamic changed. I like it, don't get me wrong, but it's definitely different! Rose in S1 is still so new to the life but she still takes awhile to realize that she won't stop traveling with the Doctor of her own free will. And then she makes the Doctor realize that too (repeatedly.) The Rose in S2 seemed more set, like she'd accepted and grown into the idea that this was her life now. I think she thought she had to appear a bit jaded to make it stick.
It's interesting to note the character development by S2's Fear Her where it's the Doctor asking Rose for compassion instead of the other way around.
I do think one of the things that changed in their dynamic was how she stopped questioning the Doctor at every turn. I think it's a natural progression of her unceasing trust in him.
Re: *uses First Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-06 11:05 pm (UTC)And she kinda does grow into the Doctor's role as he grows into hers. It's very couple-like. They trust each other and they fill in for each other when necessary.
This is even more amplified in S4's "Turn Left" when she was very much like the Doctor.
Re: *uses First Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-08 03:24 am (UTC)And I think that's why Doctor/Rose work Because it wasn't about what a typical young person's relationship is. Like she tells Mickey, saying something like: it's not like that (when Mickey says the Doctor's her new boyfriend) it's better than that. She makes that deeper connection.
Ten flirts with her a whole lot more too. He's a lot less subtle about his feelings, where as Nine kept everything pretty close to the chest. Rose's words in The Doctor Dances make me think she'd convinced herself he wasn't interested in that type of affair. Something to the extent of "doesn't the universe implode or something?" =)
Ahh, Turn Left I heart this episode so much. I really want a meaty fic with Rose in this episode. I want to know how she got to be so like the Doctor. There was something so sweet about her using a phrase and saying, "sounds like something the Doctor would say" So cute.
Re: *uses First Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-08 05:16 am (UTC)Right. It doesn't develop because of a physical attraction (hello, Martha!), though they are comfortable around each other early on. But they make each other laugh and they both enjoy running around and getting into trouble. They suit, to use an old-fashioned term.
Ten flirts with her a whole lot more too. He's a lot less subtle about his feelings, where as Nine kept everything pretty close to the chest. Rose's words in The Doctor Dances make me think she'd convinced herself he wasn't interested in that type of affair. Something to the extent of "doesn't the universe implode or something?" =)
Right. She marked him down as 'alien and not interested' even though he was blaring, 'interested! interested male-shaped person right over here! very interested!' with every glance her way.
Ahh, Turn Left I heart this episode so much. I really want a meaty fic with Rose in this episode. I want to know how she got to be so like the Doctor. There was something so sweet about her using a phrase and saying, "sounds like something the Doctor would say" So cute.
"Turn Left" is actually my very favorite episode, I discovered recently when I went through all fifty-five of them and put them in order. Catherine and Billie are wonderful together and it's amazing to see Rose fulfill all of that potential that we saw in her during the first two seasons.
Re: *uses First Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-08 05:38 am (UTC)They really ruined Martha for me when they established that. It was like a little infatuation that she turned in "oh my god i luv him" and it's like, obviously the man is broken and crazy and not actually interested in you that way. Like really...
But they make each other laugh and they both enjoy running around and getting into trouble.
Absolutely. I think Rose kept surprising the Doctor when she kept chasing after him demanding to know what was going on instead of running in the opposite direction.
Right. She marked him down as 'alien and not interested' even though he was blaring, 'interested! interested male-shaped person right over here! very interested!' with every glance her way.
I love those glances. The 'alien and not interested' always seemed like a self-preservation mechanism and as a means to keep her relationship with him something special, different, marked from her previous relationships with men (like Mickey, Jimmy Stone, etc)
Catherine and Billie are wonderful together and it's amazing to see Rose fulfill all of that potential that we saw in her during the first two seasons.
Absolutely! I thought they played so well off each other. I really adore Donna and it was lovely seeing the anticpation of Rose's return so nicely paid off in this episode (if it was dropped a little in subsequent episodes.)
I love the Rose in the episode. Grown up, independent, a leader, intelligent, and wiser. I like that she rode into an alternate reality and commanded Torchwood and UNIT to do her bidding. And I love that the TARDIS recognized her and responded to her. That scene there is one of my favorite in the series.
*uses Second Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-04 03:54 pm (UTC)I think this is more an agenda of the showrunners than anything else. It's an ongoing theme here and especially in Torchwood.
It's definitely the Doctor's personal stand. They do seem to be willing to have other characters have a measure of faith without mocking them (I'm thinking of Martha singing along with the drivers in "Gridlock" or Queen Victoria in "Tooth and Claw").
It also mocks the idea of knowing/believing in personal deities in a universe as large as ours, as well as the idea that we could possibly know the whole universe from our tiny perspective.
Though it's willing to challenge the Doctor's beliefs on that score as well (like in "The Satan Pit" when he talks to Ida about faith). We get reminded that he doesn't know everything either.
And in Torchwood especially, it emphasizes that when we die, that's it, there's nothing. We don't know what awaits us, if there's anything, so we'd better make it worthwhile.
So to me that line is well in lieu of all the other commentary about religion that the show has made.
Definitely. I have to admit that I think that's the only sensible way to live, regardless of what you believe or don't believe. If you're always living on the promise of an afterlife, you're wasting days you could be enjoying.
Re: *uses Second Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-05 04:26 pm (UTC)Oh I think the Doctor fits quite nicely into the overall theme the show has regarding religion. Isn't he always saying that something is impossible only be proven wrong?
He states it himself in The Satan Pit that if he were to ever know everything, it would make life a bit pointless. I like that the Doctor can admit he doesn't know everything. It keeps his "Lonely God" status from getting to his head.
Re: *uses Second Doctor icon*
Date: 2008-08-06 11:06 pm (UTC)Yep. Often the impossible is merely the very unlikely (as he said in "The Doctor's Daughter").
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-04 03:56 pm (UTC)And I like that the first danger Rose had to face was burning. You can probably guess why.
Hm. I would’ve said Cassandra was afraid of changing, not dying. She seemed obsessed with beauty, and apparently that still equals “youth,” five billion years in the future. But we don’t know that her surgeries had any effect on her lifespan. And she told Rose, “I am the last pure human. The others… mingled.” She let her fear of change cut her off from the rest of humanity. And, in the end, from her own humanity. (Which might make her the ultimate answer to Jackie’s little speech in “Army of Ghosts.”)
Well, her crack about breast implants in “Rose” might count as gallows humor. And I’m pretty sure that what she did to Jack was an accident, canonically. (I assume that’s what you’re talking about here.) I wanted it to be intentional, but it looks like the reactor room scene in “Utopia” is going to be the final word on the subject.
And when he left her, the door was locked, and the lock was jammed. I love that girl.
(And that’s another thing I missed, all the other times I watched this episode. I’m glad I’m rewatching.)
Another outstanding recap. Thank you.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-06 11:14 pm (UTC)This is such a beautiful show. As far as production values go, it might very well be the prettiest show that I've ever watched (Casanova, the other recent RTD production is also lavishly gorgeous -- he likes pretty things and I appreciate that).
When Rose took her first step out of the Tardis and into the future, I felt like I was going with her. When she met her first “proper” aliens, I felt like I was seeing them through her eyes. (And I still get a little dizzy, watching that scene.) I think that’s what I like best about this episode—the feeling that we’ve stepped out of the mundane and into the magical.
*nods*
She really does guide us into the Doctor's world. She's our hero figure, entering the magic world where she'll be tempted and tested and prove true.
And I like that the first danger Rose had to face was burning. You can probably guess why.
It's very thematic, particularly for Rose.
I would’ve said Cassandra was afraid of changing, not dying. She seemed obsessed with beauty, and apparently that still equals “youth,” five billion years in the future. But we don’t know that her surgeries had any effect on her lifespan. And she told Rose, “I am the last pure human. The others… mingled.” She let her fear of change cut her off from the rest of humanity. And, in the end, from her own humanity. (Which might make her the ultimate answer to Jackie’s little speech in “Army of Ghosts.”)
Though then you have to get into what Rose is going to think, hearing that a human is over three-thousand years old... from what the Doctor says about it, it sounds like her lifespan has been enhanced (though he is pretty bitter in general at the moment). The two issues are interrelated I think, at least on DW -- fear of death is fear of change and of change being permanent and irreversible.
I’m pretty sure that what she did to Jack was an accident, canonically. (I assume that’s what you’re talking about here.) I wanted it to be intentional, but it looks like the reactor room scene in “Utopia” is going to be the final word on the subject.
That's one of the things where I have to go... 'as far as the Doctor knows'. Because he doesn't actually ever seem to fully understand Bad Wolf -- not before, not during, and not after. I think that's part of why his faith in Rose during S2 is so absolute, because she became something he wasn't fully capable of understanding. Her power and her knowledge were greater than his own in that moment (like his own power was enhanced in S3). Which is something I'm probably going to go on about in great length when I get to "The Parting of the Ways" (I adore that episode and Rose is the biggest part of that).
And when he left her, the door was locked, and the lock was jammed. I love that girl.
Exactly. The second she could leave, she did. She's not a follower. Not our Rose. She's a budding hero and a potential leader, but she'll never be anyone else's soldier.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-07 04:40 am (UTC)You might be right. Goodness knows I don’t always see eye to eye with RTD. But I would’ve said just the opposite—fear of change is fear of life.
I’m not usually the type to take the Doctor’s word for things. And I wanted him to be wrong about this one. But I don’t think that’s what RTD had in mind. I needed something concrete I could point to and say, “That’s why Rose made Jack immortal.” (Ideally, I would’ve liked Rose herself to tell Jack, “This is why I made you immortal.”) But on Torchwood, Jack’s immortality is just part of who he is. (There hasn’t been a single reference to Rose in that series.) And on Doctor Who, it’s biggest effect was bringing back the Master.
*shrug* It’s one of the reasons my personal canon doesn’t line up with RTD’s after “The Christmas Invasion.”
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-07 04:59 am (UTC)I would actually agree with you on that as well. Cassandra wasn't really doing either. Because she was scared of changing and of death, she wasn't living (In "New Earth" the Doctor actually does challenge her to 'live a little'). She was existing in one single moment of constant fear and bitterness.
I’m not usually the type to take the Doctor’s word for things. And I wanted him to be wrong about this one. But I don’t think that’s what RTD had in mind. I needed something concrete I could point to and say, “That’s why Rose made Jack immortal.” (Ideally, I would’ve liked Rose herself to tell Jack, “This is why I made you immortal.”) But on Torchwood, Jack’s immortality is just part of who he is. (There hasn’t been a single reference to Rose in that series.) And on Doctor Who, it’s biggest effect was bringing back the Master.
*nods*
It's one of those things where it both makes sense to me that the Doctor would think that it was an accident and yet actually doesn't make sense as an accident at all. At the same time, it's irrelevant to Jack's life whether or not the immortality was on purpose -- to discover that the reason it happened was out of love was comforting to him but the intentionally makes no difference.
Rose doesn't remember, so she can't tell us whether or not it was on purpose. But the 'Bad Wolf' on the stairs in that one episode of Torchwood is all the evidence that I need for my theory to feel right to me. But I'm easy when it comes to things like that (and theories that can neither be proven nor disproven can be fun to talk about).
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-05 04:37 pm (UTC)The Doctor is very gleeful about the Earth burning in this episode. I suspect that he's using this trip as a way to work out some of the issues that he carries about being able to save the Earth so many times while his own people had to die. This time, he's not going to save the Earth. He's going to watch it burn to pieces and he's going to enjoy it.
I thought it was interesting that you characterized this first trip as the Doctor being a bit cruel. Cruel to himself or cruel to Rose or both?
I like this choice of his. He's testing himself and he's testing Rose. Seeing if they're both ready for this.
It reminds me of something I read elsewhere(can't remember where for the life of me) about the events of Father's Day. Like that was almost a chance to see if you could do it, if you could change things. I think he knew better, but I think it played a role in his decision to indulge Rose in seeing her own personal past so up close and personal.
Thoughts?
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-06 11:20 pm (UTC)Both. The Doctor isn't above self-punishment. But mostly Rose.
It reminds me of something I read elsewhere(can't remember where for the life of me) about the events of Father's Day. Like that was almost a chance to see if you could do it, if you could change things. I think he knew better, but I think it played a role in his decision to indulge Rose in seeing her own personal past so up close and personal.
Thoughts?
Oh, that's interesting. It makes sense that he hasn't tried anything like that since the other Time Lords kicked it, so he might not be entirely sure that the previous limitations would hold. However, I do think that him not telling Rose the easy way out once they were trapped in the church by the Reapers was about his feelings for her and not wanting her to get more hurt because of him.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-06 09:11 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-08-06 11:17 pm (UTC)*hugs*