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butterflySo, I have a sore throat, but this does not stop my enthusiasm for tomorrow's DW!
I mean, you've got a Jack reference right in the bumper trailer ('Volcano day!') and all the plot and character stuff looks very intriguing as well.
As this episode is set in the past, I'm not banking on seeing Rose (of course, I didn't expect to see her in PiC, either!). Since the Doctor (from the trailer) believes that he's landed them in Rome...
The TARDIS is landing in the wrong place again (because, sure, Pompeii was a Roman city, but it certainly wasn't Rome).
With Rose, this happened all the time, starting with The Unquiet Dead and continuing through to The Idiot's Lantern. And I think the Doctor explains a bit of why in TIP/TSP -- when Jefferson says (in a bit of a disbelieving tone), "You're telling me you don't know where you are?" the Doctor replies, "No idea. More fun that way."
For the Doctor and Rose, going places together mattered more than where those specific places were -- this applies to episodes like TIP or TLG where the Doctor and Rose really didn't seem to know where they'd landed until after they got there.
The other (larger) factor, I think, was Bad Wolf. Once Rose made the decision to go on the TARDIS, I think that she was influencing the TARDIS from when she looked into it and guided herself to the right places and times (time being... flexible that way). This would apply to such things as The Unquiet Dead, which sets up the rift to be healed by Gwyneth in such a way that Blon will be drawn to it, thus showing Rose the power of the heart of the TARDIS and leading to Bad Wolf (also, the year gap in AiL can be explained this way -- Rose needed Blon in Cardiff and that meant stopping the Slitheen in London). However, this continued into series two, when the Doctor and Rose land in Scotland in 1879. This leads to the creation of TW and (in this universe) Torchwood's feelings towards the Doctor. And then we have The Idiot's Lantern. I wasn't sure at first how that fit into the pattern -- it doesn't seem relevant to later plot points, so why would BadWolf!Rose bring them there?
And then I remembered. Magpie Electronics, which has notably appeared in two episodes since TIL -- Martha's TV in The Sound of the Drums and the microphone in Voyage of the Damned. I suspect that we may see it again and that it may be important.
When Rose was Bad Wolf, she must have seen what would happen with Torchwood -- she created Jack's immortality and Jack has been needed (not a coincidence that 'Bad Wolf' appeared on the stairs behind Jack and Tosh in Captain Jack Harkness, nor that it appeared in a disguised form behind the Doctor in Gridlock -- both were times when what Rose had done as Bad Wolf were coming into play -- CJH led to Owen mucking with the rift which led to the son of Abbadon and Jack's life force being absolutely necessary to stopping him. Gridlock has the Face of Boe's warning to the Doctor about the Master and, again, it is Rose's creation of Jack's immortality that leads to everything that happens with the Master -- without Bad Wolf, Harold Saxon could not exist). She saw that she would be lost to the parallel world and, likewise, she would have seen that she would come back (though we don't know the extent of that return yet, just with what we saw in PiC). She saw everything -- all that is, all that was, all that ever could be. And she made choices, laid out a path.
She may be still laying out that path, even now.
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(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 07:47 pm (UTC)Cool thoughts but I don't have much else to add. Except, Volcano Day! The Jack ref thrilled me. Also, like your icon. Also, just for random, HAI. ^_^
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 07:52 pm (UTC)Volcano Day, yay! Random Jack references = Win!
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 07:56 pm (UTC)EXACTLY! I don't expect Jack himself but some other reference ot his presence would be so much fun. Also, as a classics major, I'm SO EXCITED about Pompeii! And they filmed on the Rome set! *a-flail* I've been waiting for tihs one since, like, Christmas or something.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 08:02 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 08:06 pm (UTC)Also, yet another icon heart.
Also, because I forgot to say in my first comment, I'm sorry about your sore throat! Here, have virtual tea with honey. *nods*
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:40 pm (UTC)It really really does. I'm also weirdly (because I normally can take or leave them) really looking forward to the Confidential because they're gonna go round Rome! I love Rome! The city, I mean. I haven't actually seen the series, for which sin I expect to be evicted from my chosen degree any day now.
Plus, David Tennant in shorts!
*coughs*
Yes. I'm looking forward to the Confidential for reasons that are quite deep and not at all shallow.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:45 pm (UTC)*LOL* NEVER a bad thing! And hey, believe me, my reasons for wanting to see Rome are entirely shallow because I feel about Rome much the way I feel about David Tennant in shorts. Namely=guh pretty!
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 08:20 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:37 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 08:23 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:37 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 08:37 pm (UTC)They'll tell the Doctor that "She's back"... or something like that.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:35 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 08:39 pm (UTC)I'm hoping against all odds that like the Justicia mention back in Series 1, we're going to hear some reference that confirms The Stone Rose is considered canon. Like Donna gives crap Ten about not changing into a toga and he says he did that last time and isn't doing it again (or summat).
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:34 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:43 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:44 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 02:24 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:20 pm (UTC)Though I want most of the reason Rose brought Jack back was because she loved him and didn't ever want him to die. Because she is, like the Doctor said, so very human.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:33 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:34 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:36 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:37 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:38 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 09:43 pm (UTC)I adore this theory, especially the idea about Rose/Bad Wolf being the reason for the Master returning. I roll my eyes when people say that they can't see why she's so important and that "the show has to move on from Rose". Why? She's one of the driving forces behind New Who, and really did weave herself into everything. And I love that it's still happening 4 years in and overflowing onto the spin-off show. Rose is simply, and I hate to use such an overused word, awesome.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:16 am (UTC)And it's nice to meet you!
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-11 10:57 pm (UTC)I’m… I’m almost afraid to hope. I can see the threads. (I think my favorite was the one in “The Sound of Drums.”) And your theory about the Tardis landing in the wrong places seems solid. But… I couldn’t stand to be wrong about this.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:17 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 01:57 am (UTC)She may have even laid out a safe path for her to travel back from the AU, which is what we see her using in PiC.
*bounces* Oh, I hope this is even vaguely correct.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:21 am (UTC)And they've just enough hints about it for it to qualify as being seeded -- it's shown/mentioned four times in S2 (the faded graffiti in New Earth, 'something of the wolf' in T&C, Bad Wolf Virus in L&M, and Bad Wolf Bay in Doomsday) plus one 'Bad Wolf' in S3 and two mentions of Rose looking into the vortex (Gridlock, him telling Jack about it in Utopia, and the Master mentioning it in Last of the Time Lords).
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 03:26 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 08:08 am (UTC)Did you know Donna is going to ask the Doctor why exactly he can't change history, why it isn't allowed? And that she's going to dare him to do so anyway (or something along those lines)? I'm looking forward to that. Might be very interesting. Because for all of the Doctor's talk about not interfering, his sheer presence is interfering; his actions influence history. Torchwood would not have existed if it weren't for him.
Of course he saves the Earth from alien interventions and invasions, and hence is protecting Earth's history, no question about it. That's what happened in Tooth and Claw too. But because he does, because he saves it, he unwittingly alters it too.
Also: I did not pick up on those Magpie Electronic references. Perhaps they're random (maybe even the Bad Wolf ones are, you never know with RTD), but it would be nice if they were relevant.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:24 am (UTC)I would definitely love for Bad Wolf to be relevant to the current plotline.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 08:58 am (UTC)If the Doctor did that, it might even be that the Doctor was the one who took away some of Jack's memories. That would explain why Jack never refers to the incident in their later meetings.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 02:16 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-12 02:15 pm (UTC)I think Rose (as Bad Wolf) did far more to influence time than the Doctor gave her credit for and as such, she would be fundamental to New Who.
Oh, I've just had a thought; you know how the Doctor goes on about seeing the bigger picture? Could this also be a subtle hint to the audience about piecing together all the series' rather than looking at each arc in isolation? Or could it be a reference to Rose having seen the 'bigger picture' as Bad Wolf?
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:25 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-13 03:02 pm (UTC)... though now. I'm starting to wonder whether her gifting Jack with immortality means something else for her. While some have said that her being trapped in a parallel world was her 'payment' for giving him something 'wrong', but what if it wasn't. What if Rose is going to pay in a different way, for her actions as Bad Wolf? I've been thinking that the ending of season 4 is going to show us that... 0_0
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:27 am (UTC)He did! It really makes me curious about how much they may or may not attribute to what she saw when she had the Vortex inside her. She was more powerful than the Doctor -- that was made clear by what she was capable of doing. Was her sight also more powerful than his? Enough so to map out a way for her to leave him but come back.
... though now. I'm starting to wonder whether her gifting Jack with immortality means something else for her. While some have said that her being trapped in a parallel world was her 'payment' for giving him something 'wrong', but what if it wasn't. What if Rose is going to pay in a different way, for her actions as Bad Wolf? I've been thinking that the ending of season 4 is going to show us that... 0_0
Interesting. I've never thought of her needing to be punished for that or to pay for it.
(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-14 04:46 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2008-04-15 12:25 am (UTC)